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WYSIWYG Problem with Windows 10 and Expression Web 4

    Question

  • WYSIWYG (“What You See Is What You Get”) isn’t working with Microsoft Expression Web 4 running under Windows 10 on my new computer.  Windows 10 installed browsers correctly show web page formatting (as written using Expression Web 4 under Windows XP) but Expression Web 4 displays corrupted formatting on the same Windows 10 computer.  I've isolated this as a Windows 10 problem since I have the same problem on 2 Windows 10 computers but it still isn't, and never was, a problem under Window XP.

    Has anyone else run in to this?  Does anyone know how to fix it?   I've unsuccessfully spent days trying to get back to maintaining my web sites and am getting desperate.  HELP...........

    Thursday, February 25, 2016 12:10 AM

Answers

  • The Solution At Last.....

    After months of frustration and wasted time I accidentally tripped on the solution to my problem yesterday while dealing with something else.  As I suspected it's a Windows 10 settings issue which is quite simple to deal with once understood.

    It's in the Win10 (Home) "Display Settings" (right click on the desktop).  If "Change the size of text...." is set to anything but 100%, the Design Pane formatting problem occurs in EW4 and VS2015.  What with my aging eyesight I'd set it at 125% when setting up my new computer.  Early on in dealing with my Design Pane problem I'd thought to try and reset this to 100% and followed the Win10 suggestion that the changes might not take place till the user logged out and back in which I did.  This didn't help.  What I discovered yesterday is that it does work but only after a full computer re-boot, something not suggested by Win10.

    Several tests today showed that if the computer is booted at a display setting other than 100%, the problem will occur and remain even if reset to 100% (without a reboot).  Likewise, if the computer is booted while set at 100% before shutdown, there is no Design Pane formatting problem when next booted and, interestingly, the display setting can be changed to 125% or 150% without causing a problem..... till the next boot when the problem will again appear (unless booted at 100%)

    Once I understood this, my solution was simple.  I reset my monitor to a smaller screen resolution (i.e. 1280x800) and set the Display Setting permanently to 100% and now I have no problem with EW4 and VS2015 and my screen is just as easy to read as before.

    The lesson here is that, for reasons I don't understand, the Design panes in EW4 and VS2015 don't play well any Win10 (Home) Display Setting other than 100% (and after a reboot if reset from anything else).

    My thanks to all of you who've provided suggestions.

    Finally, and in spite of Scott's feeble attempt to defend Microsoft horrible support record, I'll reiterate my contempt for how poorly Microsoft has handled this.  From my perspective their technical support has been totally worthless and thus substantially non existent in helping find what turned out to be a fairly simple problem.  I've spent days (perhaps over a week) of my time looking for a solution during the course of over 4 months, spent many, many hours searching the internet, have spent hours on the phone with Dell, and through them, 4 different discussions with Microsoft tech reps (including Win10 "experts") all of whom have basically said "sorry, there's nothing we can (or will) do to help.  I've posed on various forums (including this one) with no results, posted a trouble report at the Visual Studio website, and communicated via email with someone with Visual Studio (who contacted me for satisfaction feedback after I downloaded VS2015) who said she'd have someone contact me (which never happened).  I have a very bad taste in my mouth right now for Microsoft and they have a lot of explaining to do before I'll consider investing more time and money in any more of their products. 
    • Marked as answer by EKHJR Thursday, May 12, 2016 11:02 PM
    Thursday, May 12, 2016 11:02 PM

All replies

  • There is no "WYSIWYG" in EW. Never has been. What I presume you are talking about is the design pane preview. It has always been simply an approximation of what the page will look like when viewed in an actual browser. That is all that it can ever be, since there are five major browsers, using completely different rendering engines, each with several different versions in the wild, not to mention a whole other spectrum of mobile browsers, and all of which have their own idiosyncrasies. There is no way that any single design view rendering engine can possibly represent all of the browsers out there.

    Furthermore, design view is incapable of displaying even the most rudimentary animation (CSS :hover, dropdown menus, rollovers, javascript, etc.)

    EW is a professional development program. You should be working in split view, then testing ( in at least IE (several versions), Firefox, Safari, and Chrome. If you have a significant European visitorship, add Opera to that list, Once everything is working properly in all those browsers, then it is safe to publish. If you care about your mobile visitors, you also need to test in an iOS browser (e.g. Safari mobile), and one or more of the several Android browsers before publishing.

    None of the professionals who still contribute here depend upon design view for editing their pages. That, and the vagueness of your description of your issue, means that you may not get much help here. But, good luck... ;-)

    cheers,
    scott


    Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

    Thursday, February 25, 2016 2:03 AM
  • Aside from what Scott already said - EW is NOT WYSIWYG, and can never be - I have no trouble with EW under Win 10, on any of my sites.  What can display in Design View does, and things I don't expect EW to be able to display, don't.  We have no idea what you mean by the corrupted formatting, so we can't give you any idea of why what you expect doesn't display in EW's Design pane, but the browser preview in multiple browsers is the only way, ever, to know exactly how your page looks.


    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - ASP.NET applications


    • Edited by KathyW2 Thursday, February 25, 2016 7:42 AM
    Thursday, February 25, 2016 4:22 AM
  • Thanks Kathleen and Scott.  I concur with what you both said and used the term WYSIWYG to generically to generally describe my problem and get attention which I apparently did.  Let me describe my issue in more detail because it a serious problem.

    First, I completely understand that there are minor differences in how different browsers display html and I've been dealing with that for years making minor modifications so as to display as intended with various browsers.  My problem is much more severe and serious than that.

    The background:  I've been using FrontPage and then EW4 on an XP machine for 12 or 13 years and I now maintain hundreds of web pages that I've written over the years.  I recently upgraded to a Windows 10 machine.

    When I open a previously written .htm file on my new Windows 10 machine the EW4 design pane now has serious formatting problems which didn't exist on the old XP machine when using the same EW4.  About 20% to 25% of text previously on one line now word-wraps onto the next line.  Since this is cumulative over multiple lines of text the problem has the effect of destroying the locations of my paragraph breaks, inserted photo locations, embedded tables, etc.  It creates a huge formatting mess.  It's as if either my fixed table sizes in EW4 have become smaller thus confining the test (which they haven't) or the text font size has become significantly larger (which appears to me the same size as before and which EW4 says is the same).

    While EW4 displays my files incorrectly, I note that all browsers on the same Windows 10 machine (FireFox, Chrome, IE, and Edge) display the same files just fine and as I originally intended them to.

    The effect of my problem is that I literally can't use EW4 to design or modify a web page because the results display in browsers so vastly different than in the EW4 design pane.  The problem is with the EW4 design pane running under Windows 10, not with browsers or EW4 when running under Windows XP.

    I've spent considerable time trying to understand and isolate the problem.  I have 4 computers on a network, 2 new Windows 10 machines and 2 old XP machines.  As a test I installed EW4 on all 4 computers (from the same DVD) and the problem is present on both Windows 10 computers  and there is no problem on either of the XP computers.  (My test files were all loaded from the same single computer's hard drive over the network to avoid the possibility of file corruption.) It's clearly an issue only with Windows 10 and only with EW4 and not the browsers installed on the Windows 10 machine.

    Is there possibly a setting that I haven't been able to find in EW4 (or Windows 10) that effects the way the design pane displays?

    Thanks for any suggestions you may have.  Since my web site development capabilities are effectively shut down till I solve this, I'm about to start the time consuming and incredible frustrating task of contacting Dell's Windows 10 tech support.

    Ted Hine

    Thursday, February 25, 2016 6:20 PM
  •  If what you see can only be seen on your PCs, not in browsers, we have no way to guess what is going on.   I will point out that I don't recall anyone else has complained about how EW's design pane displays their site in Win 10, other than someone who had a screen driver issue.  There is no setting in EW related to moving to Win 10.   If when you say you "upgraded to Win 10" you mean you bought a new PC with Win 10 on it, not that you upgraded your XP machine to Win 10, you maybe facing screen resolution /driver issues.


    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - ASP.NET applications


    • Edited by KathyW2 Thursday, February 25, 2016 6:40 PM
    Thursday, February 25, 2016 6:29 PM
  • Yes, the problem is only when using EW4 under Windows 10.  It's a very strange problem and I certainly can't explain it.  By "upgrading to Win 10" I meant that I purchased a brand new loaded Dell XPS 8900 with Windows 10 installed and then installed EW4 from my old DVD.

    I also haven't found anyone else on the internet complaining about this problem so apparently I'm the first.  I did look for any reason not to get a new machine before investing in the computer and the many software upgrades I've just been through and couldn't find any credible references to the fact that EW4 would have problems.

    I've tested various screen resolutions, none of which helped.  I also tried some of the options in the Windows 10 software "compatibility mode" but couldn't find anything that helped or addressed the problem.

    The facts that I have the problem only on 2 Windows 10 machines (one Dell and one HP), and not under XP,  and have no other video problems on these computers suggests that it's not a video  driver issue.

    Do you have any suggestions as to who I might contact for help.

    Thanks.

    Thursday, February 25, 2016 10:03 PM
  • Clearly the fact that no one else is having this problem means it's your PC, for some reason or another.  Do talk to Dell.

    What kind of screen does your new PC have? Is it Ultra HD? ("retina display")?   That's a case where older programs (and EW is too old to know about that kind of display) may have problems, although the other case I mentioned solved it with a manufacture's driver upgrade.

    Also (a random guess since I have no idea what your EW Design View looks like), try changing the Page Size option (lower right corner of EW's screen).



    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - ASP.NET applications




    • Edited by KathyW2 Friday, February 26, 2016 12:09 AM
    Thursday, February 25, 2016 11:43 PM
  • Well, here is another thing to try.

    Download the free version of Visual Studio. It has more capability than you may need, especially its database capabilities.

    BUT -- it has most all of the capabilities of Expression Web, and since you are familiar with Expression Web, you should have little trouble using it. Just ignore the databse stuff if you dont need it.

    Install it, open your local site with it and see if it works.

    If it does, then you are back in business.  If it does not work, then there is, as Kathy has mentioned, some underlying problem.

    It costs you nothing to try.


    ClarkNK AKA HomePage Doctor
    Database Tutorials Using ASP.NET Controls

    Friday, February 26, 2016 1:06 PM
  • Thank Kathleen and Clark:

    I have tried resetting the "Page Size" in the lower right of the design pane but it had no effect.  Also my monitor is about 3 years old but pretty state of the art but since I have the same formatting problem on two Win10 machines (one HP laptop and one Dell desktop) I don't see how the monitor could be causing the problem.

    I did talk to Costco tech support for about an hour.  (That's right..... I could buy a Dell computer cheaper from Costco than from Dell and they have their own tech support which has turned out to be better than Dell's in some regards so far.)  The gal at Costco tech support is apparently better than I at Googling and did come up with several others with the same problem but no solution.  She also found that there's a Service Pack 2 upgrade for EW4 and suggested I install it.

    I installed the SP2 upgrade and it didn't fix my problem.  I also found a Free version of EW4 for download at the Microsoft site so installed that.  Still have the problem.

    Clark suggested trying the free version of Visual Studio.  The only thing I could find that seemed to be free was called Visual Studio 2015 for Web.  I installed it but can't figure out how to open an .htm file using it as it's not recognizing my EW4 web sites or the files in them.  It seems to be looking for some kind of Visual Studio "Project" that I don't have.  Is this the program you had in mind and, if so, can you suggest how to open an .htm file?

    I have screen captures of the EW4 design panel and the same file displayed in IE for comparison if anyone would like to see them.  Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to attach them here.  If you'd like to see them, shoot me an email at tedhine at outlook dot com and I'll attache them to a reply.

    It's going to be a week or two before I have the time to seriously get back to this an find the time to spend hours on the phone with tech support which has indicated that they will contact Microsoft on my behalf.  (I'll be on vacation for awhile and have other pressing work projects requiring my attention).

    Thanks again for your help and if you have any more suggestions I'll get to them eventually.

    Ted

    Sunday, February 28, 2016 12:54 AM
  • I use the 2013 version, but assume the menu structure of the 2015 Visual Studio is similar.

    Here is what (or is similar to) what should work

    1. Open Visual Studio for Web

    2. Then in the menu you should see the choices to Open Project or Open Website. Choose Open Website.

    3. That should allow you to browse through the File System to the folder that contains your local copy of your website. When you get to that folder, highlight it, and click Open.

    That should open your website --in the  Solution Explorer panel you should see all your website pages, and you can double-click any one of them to open and work on them.

    When you are done working and have saved everthing, do File / Close Solution. A little window pops up asking if you want to save the following items, and lists something like: localhost_45678.sln*

    Personally, I find that "Solution" thing confusing and unnecessary. I always choose NO when asked if I want to save the Solution. To me the "Solution" thing is just another layer of obfuscation. I'm sure there is some use for it, but none that I have ever needed. Just say NO

    When you next need to open your website, do the same as mentioned above. Choose to open a Website, browse to the website folder, and open it.


    ClarkNK AKA HomePage Doctor
    Database Tutorials Using ASP.NET Controls

    Sunday, February 28, 2016 3:21 AM
  • FYI, the default HTML editor in VS 2015 doesn't have a Design View, it's just HTML code. You can change that by right-clicking an HTML file and choosing Open with -> HTML (web forms) editor -> set as default -> OK


    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - ASP.NET applications

    Sunday, February 28, 2016 5:54 PM
  • Thanks again.

    Clark........ When I launch "Visual Studio Express 2015 for Web" the upper left of the Start page offers 3 options:  New Project......., Open Project......., Open From Source Control...... There is no Open Web option.  "New Project" isn't what I want and I can't figure out what "Open From Source Control" does.  When when I browse my disk drive folders from "Open Project" to my web page folders it doesn't recognize my websites nor anything with an .htm file extension.  It seems to be looking for only program language Projects.  I can't find anything on the Start page that even mentions HTML or references a web site except the "........for Web" in the title. 

    Kathleen.......  sorry but I don't understand your comment about the default HTML editor and what to do about it.  Can you be more specific.

    Any other suggestions.  Thanks.

    Ted

    Monday, February 29, 2016 11:48 PM
  • I do not have VS 2015 express.  I have  VS 2015 Community Edition.  That does have "Open Web" as an option.  It's not from a "Start" menu, and perhaps that applies to Express: it's from the menu for opening or creating projects.  The "File" menu.

    My comment about the HTML editor is pretty clear.  If you don't understand it, you'll have to tell me exactly what you don't understand.  If you are using Express, it may not apply - I wouldn't know.



    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - ASP.NET applications

    Tuesday, March 01, 2016 1:31 AM
  • Heh - Microsoft drives you crazy that way

    Here is Visual Studio Express 2013 for web


    ClarkNK AKA HomePage Doctor
    Database Tutorials Using ASP.NET Controls

    Tuesday, March 01, 2016 3:43 AM
  • Ted, when you open the program, ignore the crap down in the "Start Page." Look up top, at that old-fashioned menu bar. Click "File|Open|Web Site..." A browser window will open. Browse to your Web site's root folder and select it, then click "Open." After VS does its thing, you'll see your site over on the right, in the "Solution Explorer." That's where you can do as Kathy said and use "Open with..." to switch to the HTML editor.

    However, I fear that you will be greatly disappointed. What you will see is the EW1 design pane. That's it, period. NO toolbars. NO Tag Properties or CSS Properties panes. NO Apply Styles or Manage Styles panes. NO Standard HTML or ASP.NET Toolbox. No Snippets pane. Nothing that you are familiar with, and a whole lot that you know nothing about, and that probably has nothing to do with your style of developing pages.

    And while I can't prove it without seeing your markup, I would be willing to wage good money that that VS2015/EW1 design view is not going to display your page(s) any better than the EW4 design pane that you're familiar with. Clark, bless his heart, loves Visual Studio, and rightly so, given his bent toward database applications, where VS is without question the strongest, most powerful application available for Microsoft developers. Unfortunately, it is NOT an application suited for designers, for visually-oriented Web developers such as you seem to be.

    He recommends it for pretty much any issue that someone has that has not been otherwise resolved, but, while I could certainly be wrong, I'm guessing that you're going to be sadly disappointed to have gone to so much trouble to achieve so little once you see your pages displayed in that VS2015/EW1 design pane, with that spartan, design-unfriendly user interface.

    Look, anyone here can tell you that I do not use design view for anything more than a navigation pane (click an element in the design pane and the HTML code for that element is highlighted in the code pane). I do all my editing in the code pane.

    Given your visual orientation, I'm not suggesting that you completely forsake the design pane. I am suggesting that you start working in split view, seeing what happens when you add stuff to the design pane, and learning to edit in code view, then use "Preview in Browser" to check your work, which will offer you the only truly accurate representation of your changes, instead of relying upon design view, which does not. Good luck!

    cheers,
    scott


    Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

    Tuesday, March 01, 2016 8:04 PM
  • Scott, I don't have the Express versions, but the free community versions of both VS 2013 and VS 2015 certainly do have "Toolbars ... Tag Properties ... CSS Properties panes. ... Apply Styles ... Manage Styles panes. .. Standard HTML [and] ASP.NET Toolbox."  You just have to make them visible with the View menu.

    FYI,  I've checked and yes, for the VS 2013 Community version you also need to follow my earlier post about VS 2015 to open HTML pages with a Design View.

    Now, I have no idea if this will solve the OP's problem, of course.



    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - ASP.NET applications

    Tuesday, March 01, 2016 10:09 PM
  • Thanks Scott for stepping in.  I can use all the help I can get.  I'll definitely try your suggestions but (as mentioned previously) I'm very busy this week and perhaps into next so can't get to in right now.  I'm not really looking for another way to edit my years worth of web pages but would just like to know what Microsoft programs work and which don't as a debugging tool to isolate the problem and have something to talk to tech support about when I next have the time to call them.

    I'm curious to know what version of Windows 10 those of you who are not having problems with EW4 are using.  My new Dell came with Windows 10 Home and I've just become aware that there's also a Windows 10 Pro being sold.

    Thanks again to all of you.

    Ted

    Tuesday, March 01, 2016 10:54 PM
  • Well Scott, thank you for the blessing.

    Like I said, I don't use the 2015 version, but Visual Studio 2013 for Web has virtually everything EW4 has in terms of tools, styles, panels etc.  I don't even remember having to jump thru any hoops to get the design pane available as Kathy has mentioned.

    And c'mon -- I recommended EW to someone just in the last few months. I'm pretty sure.

    As for the present problem, I only mentioned it as a possible way to get the OP back in business if he couldnt get EW going.

    And hey -- I actually have EW4 on my computer and used it to look at something just last week.

    Can't remember why, though.


    ClarkNK AKA HomePage Doctor
    Database Tutorials Using ASP.NET Controls

    Tuesday, March 01, 2016 11:00 PM
  • Ted,

    I have 3 computers running Win 10 Pro, all of them with no problems with EW4.   But the differences between Win 10 Home and Win 10 Pro are not related to displaying or supporting programs, but specific features not included in Home that are included in Pro.

    - Domain Join Services
    - BitLocker Drive Encryption
    - Remote Access Services
    - Group Policy editor



    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - ASP.NET applications

    Wednesday, March 02, 2016 4:10 AM
  • Hey Ted...

    Here is a shot in the dark.  Is it possible that when you set up EW on your new computers you have all the visual aids on.  I was thinking that maybe, in fact everything is rendering correctly, but for the first time you are seeing the formatting issues visually? 

    Just a thought...

    Peter

    Tuesday, April 19, 2016 12:48 AM
  • Scott, I don't have the Express versions, but the free community versions of both VS 2013 and VS 2015 certainly do have "Toolbars ... Tag Properties ... CSS Properties panes. ... Apply Styles ... Manage Styles panes. .. Standard HTML [and] ASP.NET Toolbox."  You just have to make them visible with the View menu.

    Ahh... right. I was looking at VS 2010 Web Developer Express. The "View" menu there offers no such options. I had installed the VS 2015 community version and you are correct. Those panes are indeed available, although not by default.

    Now that I've configured those options, and changed the UI to the "Blue" color scheme, it doesn't look nearly so intimidating to a new user. It still has an awful lot of development/debugging stuff in the UI to totally confuse a newbie who has no idea what all that stuff is for (and which he will probably never use). And there are far fewer learning resources for simple Web development available for VS than for EW.

    That said, for anyone wanting to go beyond the ASP.NET capabilities offered by EW, or someone experiencing issues like the OP's, I could see recommending CS2015 community to them (and not neglecting to explain these configuration issues to them ;-).

    cheers,
    scott


    Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

    Tuesday, April 19, 2016 6:04 PM
  • Thanks to those who've recently commented.  I was away and/or busy with other things for the past month and am just getting back to this.

    To review and summarize my issue:  A few months back I purchased a Windows 10 (Home) computer to replace my trusty 12 year old WinXP machine.  Before doing so I looked around the internet and couldn't find a reason why Expression Web 4 or FrontPage 2003 wouldn't run on it.  I had no problem installing EW4 and FP but quickly discovered a serious problem with both's "Design" panes which don't format/display my old HTML files the same as on the XP machine and in all major web browsers on the same Windows 10 machine.  The browsers correctly show my files as I designed them but the EW4/BP Design panes appear to word-wrap about 20% to 25% of the text on a line to the next line.  It's as if font size were bigger (which it isn't and isn't apparent from looking at it) or the tables the text is contained in are smaller than specified (which they aren't).  What ever the cause, the problem (which is cumulative) absolutely destroys the locations of my embedded text, tables, images, etc. in the Design pane making it impossible for me to change or create new HTML files as they appear so differently in browsers.  In a attempt to isolate the problem I've installed EW4 on my second WinXP machine and my Win10 laptop.  It runs fine on both XP machines and has the same problem on both Win10 machines.  This strongly suggests to me that there's a setting somewhere in Win10 that isn't set correctly that I can't find or perhaps a difference between Win10 Home and Pro.

    A recent update:  Last week I installed Visual Studio 2015 (Community) and it has exactly the same problem with it's (hard to find) Design pane (character for character) as EW4 and FP.  So it's clear that this isn't just an issue with products Microsoft isn't supporting anymore.   I submitted a problem report through VS2015's help menu but of course haven't heard back (and they tell you not to necessarily expect a reply).

    I've concluded that Microsoft is now the most evil company on the planet.  Their tech support is terrible and they appear to have no interest in solving my problem.  Dell has transferred me to Microsoft tech support twice now.  Both times I had massive trouble understanding the tech rep. due to their accent combined with horrible phone connections and both times they didn't even want to take the time to fully understand my problem.  On the first call (before I knew about the VS2015 connection) when I mentioned EW4 the rep basically just said "no longer supported.... goodby.  The second call (yesterday) when I mentioned that VS2015 also had the problem the rep said to contact the MSDN and pay $499 to just talk with someone...... something I think is absurd for a problem that only applies to the new Win10 op sys.  Given that some of you have no problem running EW4 on Win10 there must be a simple solution to this...... I just continue to need help finding it.

    Do any of you have a MSDN tech support subscription that would allow you to talk to them on my behalf without costing you anything?

    A little bit about me:  I'm 71 years old and substantially retired on a limited fixed income.  I'm not a web design professional (which explains why I don't understand or use a lot of the terminology that the pros use) but have spent considerable time in the past 15 years doing serious genealogical research and documenting generations of my ancestors as a huge web site which now contains hundreds and hundreds of web pages.  Thus, I derive no income from my web design efforts.  Purchasing a new computer this year has been stressful enough on my finances and I don't have money to pay the MSDN ransom.  As of right now, Microsoft has my project shut down.

    Any continuing help and/or suggestions are appreciated.

    Ted

    Wednesday, April 20, 2016 5:16 PM
  • Hi...

    Can you take a screen shot?  Maybe that will give someone a clue.

    Best,

    Peter

    Wednesday, April 20, 2016 6:47 PM
  • First of all, please don't play the age/income card. Many of us still contributing here are either retired or near it. If you read Kathy's profile you will find that she is semi-retired after a long and successful career. I am within five years of you, semi-retired, and on a fixed, limited income. That status does not make you stupid, feeble-minded, or incapable of learning new things. Quite the contrary; it means that you now have plenty of time available to you to devote to learning more about how to do what seems to mean a great deal to you—creating and maintaining your Web site.

    Secondly, Microsoft is NOT "...now the most evil company on the planet." They have generously provided us with a very competent, professional-level Web development platform, entirely free of charge. Most companies who discontinue products simply remove them from distribution, completely. Microsoft has maintained download servers for the entire Expression studio product family, and continues to maintain MSDN forums for all of those products (although I'll admit that I thought taking down the Expression Gallery was needless, and kinda cheesy).

    Furthermore, Microsoft has not made ANY revenue off the studio products since they were discontinued five years ago. None. Yet you expect them to provide free tech support for those products five years later. Do you have any idea what it costs to maintain a support structure? How much do you suppose a fully trained, experienced technician makes a year? How many do you imagine they have to have on staff to respond to the tens, or maybe hundreds, of thousands of MS developers worldwide? Right.

    Here's the thing: MS has always charged for support for their developer products. Always. And way back when EW was first released, they declared it to be a developer product. Support calls were always $259/$99 for phone/email support, per incident (an "incident" being defined as from initial contact with a tech all the way to final resolution of the issue). Apparently, support for Visual Studio is even more expensive, since you say it was quoted at $499.

    Finally, as you yourself have already noted, the problem is NOT with EW. EW has not changed. The issue arises only when you install it on Windows 10, on a new computer. That is not an indictment of Win10, since many people here are running it on 10 without this issue. (This would also cause any "bug report" to be resolved as "not reproducible.") It may be an issue with your new computer, since there may be hardware settings that are affecting the issue.

    The point is, given the clear evidence, the problem is not in the application or the OS, which are the only MS products in the loop here. Therefore, while MS is certainly no sweet, philanthropic angel, they are not to blame here, and you have no call to be making such vile, unwarranted accusations about them.

    Now, as to working around your problem, the solution is simple—just edit in the source code. Yes, I understand that you do not know/understand HTML and CSS, but that is easily remedied. No, seriously. Many people mistakenly believe that HTML and CSS are programming languages. They are not. HTML is a simple markup language (hence the name, HyperText Markup Language). It is used to describe the content contained in a page—paragraphs, headings, images, etc. Simple wrappers (e.g. <h1>heading</h1>, <p>paragraph</p>, <div>content</div>, etc.) are used to layout the content of the page, and that is all that HTML is, markup wrappers.

    Likewise, CSS is a descriptive language used to describe the presentation of the page (e.g. margin-left:10px; color:red; padding:2em; float:right, etc.). Neither contains any of the elements which make programming languages difficult (control structures, data types, class definitions, inheritance, polymorphism, etc.).

    Within literally a few hours of starting to learn HTML you will be able to look at the source code of your page and begin to make sense of it, especially if you do so in split view. In that view, you can click an element in design view, and EW will instantly move to and highlight the source code in the code window, making it clear how the source code is related to the element as viewed in the browser. You can learn a great deal doing just that after you have begun learning HTML tags (those wrappers).

    So, how do you get started? I would advise checking out the Learning Resources and Reference Sites section of the Forum FAQs and Guidelines - Start Here. Start by downloading and viewing Cheryl's excellent "Build a Basic Web Site" video tutorial, at http://by-expression.com/page/EW-Video-Basic-Website-tutorial. While there, be sure to grab the "assets.zip" file (link at lower left corner), which contains all of the images and other assets used in the tutorial. Watch the tutorial all the way through the first time. Then unzip the assets file and work through the tutorial with Cheryl. I guarantee that at the end of that time you will have a very solid grasp of the fundamental principles of both HTML and CSS.

    After that, explore the other resources available in that list, with particular attention to the completely free, self-paced mini-courses available from w3schools at http://w3schools.com/html/ and http://w3schools.com/css/. You can work through as many or as few as you wish, or simply use them as a reference source, referring to them as you encounter questions about particular subjects.

    It's up to you. There's no reason in the world why you can't learn what you need to know. That, or you can continue to molder, and to keep blaming MS for something that isn't their fault. Your choice...  ;-)

    cheers,
    scott


    Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

    • Marked as answer by EKHJR Thursday, May 12, 2016 11:00 PM
    • Unmarked as answer by EKHJR Thursday, May 12, 2016 11:00 PM
    Friday, April 22, 2016 2:27 AM
  • The Solution At Last.....

    After months of frustration and wasted time I accidentally tripped on the solution to my problem yesterday while dealing with something else.  As I suspected it's a Windows 10 settings issue which is quite simple to deal with once understood.

    It's in the Win10 (Home) "Display Settings" (right click on the desktop).  If "Change the size of text...." is set to anything but 100%, the Design Pane formatting problem occurs in EW4 and VS2015.  What with my aging eyesight I'd set it at 125% when setting up my new computer.  Early on in dealing with my Design Pane problem I'd thought to try and reset this to 100% and followed the Win10 suggestion that the changes might not take place till the user logged out and back in which I did.  This didn't help.  What I discovered yesterday is that it does work but only after a full computer re-boot, something not suggested by Win10.

    Several tests today showed that if the computer is booted at a display setting other than 100%, the problem will occur and remain even if reset to 100% (without a reboot).  Likewise, if the computer is booted while set at 100% before shutdown, there is no Design Pane formatting problem when next booted and, interestingly, the display setting can be changed to 125% or 150% without causing a problem..... till the next boot when the problem will again appear (unless booted at 100%)

    Once I understood this, my solution was simple.  I reset my monitor to a smaller screen resolution (i.e. 1280x800) and set the Display Setting permanently to 100% and now I have no problem with EW4 and VS2015 and my screen is just as easy to read as before.

    The lesson here is that, for reasons I don't understand, the Design panes in EW4 and VS2015 don't play well any Win10 (Home) Display Setting other than 100% (and after a reboot if reset from anything else).

    My thanks to all of you who've provided suggestions.

    Finally, and in spite of Scott's feeble attempt to defend Microsoft horrible support record, I'll reiterate my contempt for how poorly Microsoft has handled this.  From my perspective their technical support has been totally worthless and thus substantially non existent in helping find what turned out to be a fairly simple problem.  I've spent days (perhaps over a week) of my time looking for a solution during the course of over 4 months, spent many, many hours searching the internet, have spent hours on the phone with Dell, and through them, 4 different discussions with Microsoft tech reps (including Win10 "experts") all of whom have basically said "sorry, there's nothing we can (or will) do to help.  I've posed on various forums (including this one) with no results, posted a trouble report at the Visual Studio website, and communicated via email with someone with Visual Studio (who contacted me for satisfaction feedback after I downloaded VS2015) who said she'd have someone contact me (which never happened).  I have a very bad taste in my mouth right now for Microsoft and they have a lot of explaining to do before I'll consider investing more time and money in any more of their products. 
    • Marked as answer by EKHJR Thursday, May 12, 2016 11:02 PM
    Thursday, May 12, 2016 11:02 PM
  • I'm glad you found the solution to your problem, but I'm curious what you mean by "how poorly Microsoft has handled this"?  The last release of EW was 4 years ago.  Win 10 and its text size settings didn't exist then, and EW4 has been free since then, so I'm not sure what you were expecting in terms of support.  Do they even offer support for EW now?


    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - ASP.NET applications



    • Edited by KathyW2 Thursday, May 12, 2016 11:28 PM
    Thursday, May 12, 2016 11:22 PM
  • Well it's not the first time that a Microsoft release of an upgrade somewhere caused a problem with an old, no longer supported, seemingly unrelated program.

    I've stayed with Office 2000 Word, Access, and Excel programs, and with each release of Windows it becomes more uncertain that they will keep working. I'm currently on Windows 7 (moved when forced off XP because support for that stopped) where I will stay until forced to move to Windows 10.  The Office 2000 programs aren't even guaranteed to work with Windows 7, but they do.

    Somewhere along the line, a system-type upgrade having nothing to do with Excel caused me to be unable to close the program by normal means.  Excel still works fine, but File/Exit or clicking on the X in the upper right corner will not close it. Nope. Have to do ctrl-alt-delete and close it from the Task Manager.

    I have never remotely imagined that MS would have any interest in fixing the problem, so I live with it. That's just life in the old software department.


    ClarkNK AKA HomePage Doctor
    Database Tutorials Using ASP.NET Controls

    Saturday, May 14, 2016 12:21 PM
  • I have had the same problem. Of course I  have been very desperated because of not finding the reason.
    Many thanks that you have written about your solution.
    With best regards from Hamburg (Germany)

    Franz S

    Saturday, June 11, 2016 9:46 PM
  • Here is the best solution I have found.  It allows EW4 to work properly in design mode even on Windows 10 with a high resolution graphics card and dpi scaling set at any percentage.  It requires a single compatibility change.

    I searched the web for a long time trying to solve the issue of the tiny design window in EW4 after updating to Win10 and a high resolution display.  I found nothing so I have posted my fix in hopes Google and Bing will index it.  The full post is here: http://www.mresoftware.com/ExpressionWeb4.htm or just follow the instructions below.

    Give it a try.  It is easy,  should be safe, reversible, and makes Expression Web work great on high resolution displays.

    ------------------
    1. Download the Microsoft Application Compatibility Toolkit  READ THE PAGE FIRST.   For Windows 10 you need to expand the Related Resources and download Windows  Assessment and Deployment Kit (ADK) for Windows 10.  For older versions of  Windows, I suppose the 5.6 version will work.

    2. Install the ADK.  I opted to only install the  compatibility administrator tool.

    3. Once installed, run the Compatibility Administrator (32  bit) version.

    4. In the left frame you will see Custom Databases.   Expand it if it isn't already and you will see New Database(1).  Right  Click and select Create New > Application Fix.

    5. Program Name: Microsoft Expression Web 4     Vendor: Microsoft    Program File Location: C:\Program Files  (x86)\Microsoft Expression\Web 4\ExpressionWeb.exe     NOTE  that the file location may be different on your computer.  Mine is set up  pretty standard with Windows on the C: drive.   PRESS Next.

    6. Nothing needs changing on this first screen so press  Next again.

    7. Scroll down and find DPIUnaware.  Check the box beside it.  Test run it if you like then press  Next.

    8. Nothing to change on this screen.  Press Finish.

    9. Now highlight New Database(1) in the list again then  select Save in the command ribbon.  Go through the naming and saving ritual.

    10. Now Right Click your new database and select Install.   After this it should show up under Installed Databases.  You can close the  program.


    Sunday, September 04, 2016 3:39 PM
  • Thanks for the ADK info Joe :)

    I've just followed your instructions and they work well - thanks for that!
    The Design view in EW4 was rather small on my high-res Lenovo 500. All this DPI scaling is pretty tricky to get right. Some images aren't quite as sharp when 'up scaled' but without it text isn't comfortable to use.

    I had been looking at using the DPI hack documented here: www.danantonielli.com/adobe-app-scaling-on-high-dpi-displays-fix which seems very popular, but your method seems easier (no Registry editing).

    My tip: To revert to normal setup (or flip between settings) I've found applying the "Disable display scaling on high DPI settings" reverses the ADK changes. To put the changes back it's easy to uncheck the setting - found Properties > Compatibility tab for EW4.

    Thanks again.

    Monday, September 05, 2016 4:03 PM
  • None of the EW4 previews work, ie display exactly the web page you see after publishing.  Text is skewed, images overlap others.   It doesn't matter what preview (wysiwyg) you use.

    I also have another editor called WYSIWYG, which is 2016 edition and thus contains all the right formats, ie ccs3 and html5.  It DOES NOT display correctly either on its built in viewers.  

    Yet, on my website, the display is perfect in ANY BROWSER and ANY device from 27" monitor to my iPad2.

    Go figure.   These editors have work to do to be able to preview your pages correctly, LOCALLY.

    Wednesday, October 12, 2016 1:38 PM
  • "None of the EW4 previews work, ie display exactly the web page you see after publishing."

    Preview in browser, which is the only "Preview" EW has, shows you exactly what you see when your site is published.  It's the same browser reading the same HTML and CSS, with the same images.

    If that doesn't work for you, you are doing something wrong, or there is something very wrong on your machine.



    Kathleen Wilber
    BrightWillow - Asp.Net Applications

    Wednesday, October 12, 2016 3:40 PM
  • None of the EW4 previews work, ie display exactly the web page you see after publishing.

    If by "preview" you are referring to the design view in EW, then of course they "don't work." Design view is not a browser, and cannot possibly provide a display conformant with the multitude of different browsers' rendering engines currently extant. Besides the "major four" desktop browsers, each also has a mobile version, not to mention the proprietary browsers of each of the mobile manufacturers. Design view provides nothing more than a sketch view of the page.

    As Kathy has stated, to view your page as it will appear in a browser, use "Preview in Browser" and select the target browser you want to test in. That is the only way you can truly test to see how the Gecko (Mozilla), Trident (IE), Webkit (Safari), Presto/Blink (Opera), and Blink (Chrome) rendering engines display the page is to actually test in those browsers. In that way you can catch any incompatibilities (they still exist) between the different DOM implementations and rendering practices.

    cheers,
    scott


    Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

    Wednesday, October 12, 2016 6:10 PM
  • After scrolling through thousands of so called fixes yours was the only one that actually worked. Thank you! The ADK did the trick and Expression Web is now showing the proper scaling on my Windows 10 Toshiba 4K Ultra HD laptop.
    Friday, October 21, 2016 9:43 PM
  • Wow Scott,

    • All this guy wanted was a little help and this is how you treat people?

    Thursday, January 05, 2017 11:08 AM
  • Wow er... Tobor, did you actually read my post? Nowhere was I unkind or discourteous to the poster. Nowhere did I say that he was wrong to ask the question, nor did I castigate him in any way.

    In the first paragraph I simply pointed out, accurately, why it is impossible for any design mode preview to accurately represent all of the browsers currently in use. In fact, for brevity's sake I left out the fact that since the design pane is neither a browser nor a server, anything animated by CSS (e.g. :hover effects such as rollovers and dropdown menus), or created or animated by javascript, or created or animated by server-side code, simply will not show up in the design pane.

    Then, in the second paragraph, I simply described to him what are considered to be best practices for Web development, practices that I, and Kathy, and Clark, and, I daresay, every other regular contributor to this forum follow in our own development process. Looking back at your posting history, you do not appear to be a Web developer, so perhaps you do not recognize this as being simply a description of best practice, but that is what it is.

    I do note from your persistence in your Microsoft Project question that, like this poster, you seem to expect software to do things that are not part of its designed, intended function, so perhaps that colors your response to my post. But, I do not believe that any reasonable adult would consider my response to him to be out of line or unhelpful.

    cheers,
    scott


    Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

    Thursday, January 05, 2017 8:51 PM
  • Hey Tobor,

    While Scott might not always have the best bedside manner...he has done as much, or more, to support people needing help!  There are a handful of people who answer all the questions that are posted...without his insight, we would all be in trouble. 

    He is just straight forward with his responses.   So, instead of giving him a hard time, you should be thankful that people like him give of their time to help everyone out!

    Best,

    Peter

    Saturday, January 07, 2017 3:45 AM
  • Thank you. I am very happy. Your simple solution solved my problem! Thanks!
    Wednesday, March 01, 2017 3:12 PM