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Working on a back-end via VPN RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hey all,

    We have a back-end and about 20 users whose use their own front-end. This works well, but not very fast.
    Now with corona, they works from home via VPN. This works very slow. They can't work like this. Is there another way to use? The local front-end is linked via VPN to the backend wich has a lot of related tables.


    Monday, March 23, 2020 8:50 PM

Answers

  • The simple issue and problem is that a VPN is very slow.

    Your typical low cost bargain basement network (even for a small business) is rated these days at about 1000 base T.

    So, many years ago, things started out as 10 base T

    Then we adopted 100 base T.

    And now, even very low cost office networks are based on 1000 base T.

    Your high speed internet is rated at say 10 mbits. Even let’s say you have a really good high speed internet plan (but that’s on the company side – what does the home users have????).

    So, even if they have a 30 or 50 mbits plan? Well, 1000/50 = 20 times slower!!!!

    So, if something that took say 4 seconds? Well x 20 = 80 seconds (that is 1 minute and 20 seconds!!!).

    So, upping the speed of the internet plans by 50% or even more is only going to reduce say that 4-5 minutes down to 2-3 minutes. And that assumes that both ends (company internet plan and the home user internet plans) are first rate. (So to see any real improvements you have to increase speeds at both ends. And worse, from the home users point of view? The limitation is the UP-LOAD speed of the company internet plan. Often plans have really great download speed, but up-load speeds are still rather low.

    So, even the higher speed plans in most cases are MUCH MUCH slower than your bargain basement low cost company network that is going to be 10, or even 50 times faster in most cases.

    Slow internet connections (compared to office network) means a slow connection.

    If you have to go 60 miles, then you can do that in a car in 1 hour going 60 miles per hour.

    However, if you now have to walk? Well, heck walking 30 miles in ONE day going to take too long. Typical walking speed is about 3 miles in one hour. So to walk 30 miles, that will take you 10 hours!!!

    So while we all use the term “fast” or “high speed” internet? Well, it might be called fast, but it is NOTHING close to your speed of that low cost company network.

    So, what can you do?

    Well, the most practical setup here is to adopt windows terminal server. This so called “remote desktop” technology allows you to “view” and see a remote screen, but only mouse clicks and screen updates are transferred. So, the speed of typical internet can be used here.

    Think of how “remote” support works – they can use + view your desktop. Terminal server is the same idea. And it much like GoToMyPC or say “team viewer” that allows one to work remote. The difference (advantage) of terminal services is that users don’t have to remote into an actual computer, but the terminal server “makes up” many desktops on one computer for everyone to log remote into. So the one computer is like a “main frame” or “web site” in which many users can remote into.

    Other possible:

    Well, if the back end was SQL server, then this setup can work. However, this setup ONLY works well if the Access applications been optimized to work with a SQL server back end. (You have to be VERY good with sql server to get this setup to work well).

    So, right now, without having to re-write your software, then some form of remote desktop (terminal services) is your best bet.

    You can read about the slow internet problem here (or have your IT folks read the following:

    http://www.kallal.ca//Wan/Wans.html

    I wrote the above article MANY years ago. For some strange and bizarre reason, AFTER an IT department reads the above, they often suggest to use a higher internet plan. I ask them how much faster and better the new plan is.

    They come back and say it is 40% better. Well, if a query or form is taking 7 minutes to load, and you reduce that time by 40%? Well, you still about 4 minutes for what was once taking 3-4 seconds. So, throwing more network speed in 99% of cases WILL NOT fix or even come close to addressing this issue. And worse yet, is you don’t have control over the home users internet plan – which tend to be even slower then costly company internet plans.

    And when IT floats a 30% increased speed plan? Huh? We all have to go back to basic math. If something is taking 20 seconds? Well, with 30% better increase – it still going to take about 14 seconds!!! – Still way way too slow!!

    So you could use say team-viewer or goto my pc. That would allow in a hurry for users to “remote” into their desktops. However, if they have laptops that they take home, then there is no remote desktop to “remote” into. However, terminal services means that one server will “make” and “provide” desktops for all the users to remote into.

    And speed of remote desktop – even on a low cost home network will work VERY well.

    Right now? The quick way, and least amount of issues and problems is to get your IT folks to setup terminal server. Then users can connect their VPN, and then launch a remote desktop connect to the terminal server.

    Even coffee shop Wi-Fi will work well with such a setup.

    So remote desktop is your most practical solution. You can read that article on wans - it was written many years ago, and it sill 100% relevant today. In fact, your office networks since I wrote this have increased from 100 base T to 1000 base T (10 times the speed). However, in general, people have not seen a 10 times speed increase in their internet plans. I have seen some really great VPN's work ok now, but then the issue of corruptions I note in that above WANS article will come into play anyway.

    Regards,

    Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP 2003-2017)

    Edmonton, Alberta Canada

    • Proposed as answer by jon1854 Wednesday, March 25, 2020 3:07 PM
    • Marked as answer by Lteu Thursday, March 26, 2020 7:27 AM
    Monday, March 23, 2020 9:53 PM
  • Take a look at the following article, the solutions are all applicable to your scenario

    https://www.devhut.net/2016/09/24/access-back-end-location-wan-online-server-onedrive-dropbox/


    Daniel Pineault, 2010-2019 Microsoft MVP
    Professional Support: http://www.cardaconsultants.com
    MS Access Tips and Code Samples: http://www.devhut.net

    • Marked as answer by Lteu Thursday, March 26, 2020 7:27 AM
    Tuesday, March 24, 2020 1:10 AM

All replies

  • The simple issue and problem is that a VPN is very slow.

    Your typical low cost bargain basement network (even for a small business) is rated these days at about 1000 base T.

    So, many years ago, things started out as 10 base T

    Then we adopted 100 base T.

    And now, even very low cost office networks are based on 1000 base T.

    Your high speed internet is rated at say 10 mbits. Even let’s say you have a really good high speed internet plan (but that’s on the company side – what does the home users have????).

    So, even if they have a 30 or 50 mbits plan? Well, 1000/50 = 20 times slower!!!!

    So, if something that took say 4 seconds? Well x 20 = 80 seconds (that is 1 minute and 20 seconds!!!).

    So, upping the speed of the internet plans by 50% or even more is only going to reduce say that 4-5 minutes down to 2-3 minutes. And that assumes that both ends (company internet plan and the home user internet plans) are first rate. (So to see any real improvements you have to increase speeds at both ends. And worse, from the home users point of view? The limitation is the UP-LOAD speed of the company internet plan. Often plans have really great download speed, but up-load speeds are still rather low.

    So, even the higher speed plans in most cases are MUCH MUCH slower than your bargain basement low cost company network that is going to be 10, or even 50 times faster in most cases.

    Slow internet connections (compared to office network) means a slow connection.

    If you have to go 60 miles, then you can do that in a car in 1 hour going 60 miles per hour.

    However, if you now have to walk? Well, heck walking 30 miles in ONE day going to take too long. Typical walking speed is about 3 miles in one hour. So to walk 30 miles, that will take you 10 hours!!!

    So while we all use the term “fast” or “high speed” internet? Well, it might be called fast, but it is NOTHING close to your speed of that low cost company network.

    So, what can you do?

    Well, the most practical setup here is to adopt windows terminal server. This so called “remote desktop” technology allows you to “view” and see a remote screen, but only mouse clicks and screen updates are transferred. So, the speed of typical internet can be used here.

    Think of how “remote” support works – they can use + view your desktop. Terminal server is the same idea. And it much like GoToMyPC or say “team viewer” that allows one to work remote. The difference (advantage) of terminal services is that users don’t have to remote into an actual computer, but the terminal server “makes up” many desktops on one computer for everyone to log remote into. So the one computer is like a “main frame” or “web site” in which many users can remote into.

    Other possible:

    Well, if the back end was SQL server, then this setup can work. However, this setup ONLY works well if the Access applications been optimized to work with a SQL server back end. (You have to be VERY good with sql server to get this setup to work well).

    So, right now, without having to re-write your software, then some form of remote desktop (terminal services) is your best bet.

    You can read about the slow internet problem here (or have your IT folks read the following:

    http://www.kallal.ca//Wan/Wans.html

    I wrote the above article MANY years ago. For some strange and bizarre reason, AFTER an IT department reads the above, they often suggest to use a higher internet plan. I ask them how much faster and better the new plan is.

    They come back and say it is 40% better. Well, if a query or form is taking 7 minutes to load, and you reduce that time by 40%? Well, you still about 4 minutes for what was once taking 3-4 seconds. So, throwing more network speed in 99% of cases WILL NOT fix or even come close to addressing this issue. And worse yet, is you don’t have control over the home users internet plan – which tend to be even slower then costly company internet plans.

    And when IT floats a 30% increased speed plan? Huh? We all have to go back to basic math. If something is taking 20 seconds? Well, with 30% better increase – it still going to take about 14 seconds!!! – Still way way too slow!!

    So you could use say team-viewer or goto my pc. That would allow in a hurry for users to “remote” into their desktops. However, if they have laptops that they take home, then there is no remote desktop to “remote” into. However, terminal services means that one server will “make” and “provide” desktops for all the users to remote into.

    And speed of remote desktop – even on a low cost home network will work VERY well.

    Right now? The quick way, and least amount of issues and problems is to get your IT folks to setup terminal server. Then users can connect their VPN, and then launch a remote desktop connect to the terminal server.

    Even coffee shop Wi-Fi will work well with such a setup.

    So remote desktop is your most practical solution. You can read that article on wans - it was written many years ago, and it sill 100% relevant today. In fact, your office networks since I wrote this have increased from 100 base T to 1000 base T (10 times the speed). However, in general, people have not seen a 10 times speed increase in their internet plans. I have seen some really great VPN's work ok now, but then the issue of corruptions I note in that above WANS article will come into play anyway.

    Regards,

    Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP 2003-2017)

    Edmonton, Alberta Canada

    • Proposed as answer by jon1854 Wednesday, March 25, 2020 3:07 PM
    • Marked as answer by Lteu Thursday, March 26, 2020 7:27 AM
    Monday, March 23, 2020 9:53 PM
  • Take a look at the following article, the solutions are all applicable to your scenario

    https://www.devhut.net/2016/09/24/access-back-end-location-wan-online-server-onedrive-dropbox/


    Daniel Pineault, 2010-2019 Microsoft MVP
    Professional Support: http://www.cardaconsultants.com
    MS Access Tips and Code Samples: http://www.devhut.net

    • Marked as answer by Lteu Thursday, March 26, 2020 7:27 AM
    Tuesday, March 24, 2020 1:10 AM
  • Thanks Daniel and Albert. I shall go to try remote desktop, but i have no experience with that
    Thursday, March 26, 2020 7:35 AM