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I Would Like To Offer Some Strong Advice For The Next Version Of Windows 8.

    General discussion

  • Hello. I would like to add some suggestions to improve for the retail (first) public release of upcoming Windows operating system code named, "Windows 8" sometime later this year (2012).

    I have been spending some time with the Pre-Beta or Developer Preview of Windows 8. I have had success with installing software like an internet security software and some other developing with it. I have to add that on the surface at this time, Microsoft needs to accommodate Windows 8 users who wish or need to have no direct usage of the Metro GUI interface and use Windows 8 from the desktop only. I am aware of that simple registry value change that will revert it back to Windows 7 GUI with a start menu. I would hope the non-Metro desired users would have the ability to restore the Windows 7-like start menu in lieu of the Metro GUI in the final retail release of Windows 8. This known simple registry modification not only restores the start menu, but as a side effect also restores Windows 7's Windows Explorer Command Bar GUI and the standard Windows 7 Task Manager too. I would hope all of these Windows 8 feature functions I have just mentioned would be 'independently' user adjustable/switchable and NOT an "all inclusive" revert to Windows 7 features and functions. These Windows 8 improved features could be "more user selective" (or customizable) and the user could gain some of the improved feature functions known inherent to Windows 8. For example, in Windows 8, turn off the Metro GUI (restore the start menu like Windows 7); but maintain Windows 8's Windows Explorer ribbon GUI and improved Windows 8 Task Manager. Customizable "Individual" switches or user settings would make the Windows 8 feature improvements user selective instead of an all-in-one scenario.

    Expanding on this user customizable 'individual switches' or settings options, "novice" Windows users that have had little or no working knowledge of system registry modifications to achieve these changes, could have a simple one time direct windows dialog box during the Windows setup process or better; added Windows 8 control panel options that through the use of radio buttons the user would select desired GUI functional interfaces of either Windows 7 or 8 features and functions.  For example: The Windows 8's Metro GUI (or Windows7's Start Menu), Windows Explorer ribbon GUI (or Windows 7's Command Bar), and the improved Task Manager (or the Windows 7's Task Manager), etc. -- again, all individual customizable settings.

    I see this can be easily done without too much extensive programming intervention. Let me advise and take this to the bank: Without these modest user adjustable settings implemented into Windows 8 will severely degrade the reputation of Windows 8 in short time from those user's who have negative first impressions of some interaction of Windows 8's user interface. For example, those who experience at the first time the new Metro GUI without a quick out or fret at the missing Windows start menu in Windows 8 where I have previously addressed above. Also, these customizable Windows 8 'individual switches' or user restore option settings need to be declared and posted in the instructions or material that comes with the physical DVD or online if I understand correctly this next version of Windows (Windows 8) will be now available as an online download.   

    Thank you!

     



    Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:37 AM

All replies

  • Actually after using start screen for a while I started to get used to it. And I dont really need start menu that much now. The only issue in my opinion is the ugly desktop taskbar with the black square at the left. They could at least make it transparent. And make charms appear as a small start menu when clicked on start button, not when hovering mouse on it. And disable the huge black clock tile on desktop, but keep it on metro.

    Id say make a small desktop start menu with 5 charms and links to control panel, my computer, user folder and library folder. And make a  nice transparent start button. The rest can be done through the new start screen.

    Tuesday, January 10, 2012 12:10 PM
  • I agree montecarlo1987.  I've yet to see anyone, including the Microsoft blogs attempting to justify using 'pixel counting' as the reason for the interface change, as to why it would be bad to make it "optional" to use the Metro or normal Win7 style start menu on a desktop/laptop.  As it is, I find Metro a complete failure on the laptop I'm testing it on.  Without a touch style (iPad clone) device, Metro has made me want to just not turn the computer on.  As it is, I would have to recommend to my organization to not waste any time or money moving to Windows 8 since we're still converting to Windows 7 on our 10,000 computers.  We have enough headaches to deal with from our users and to give them an interface and functionality of a 'Fisher Price K-Mart toy' would be a terrible decision for us.  We have just an extremely small handfull of iPad pretend computers on our network and it seems Windows 8 is only being designed with those in mind.

    Why it can't be "optional" to let me use a real Start Menu and Desktop interface versus the limited and disfunctional Metro interface is rather perplexing to me, but then Microsoft isn't interested in what I think and doesn't seem too interested in making Windows 8 flexible enough to fill both the touch tablet and desktop/laptop market and would appear to feel that desktops & laptops belong in the trash heap.



    • Edited by KHemmelman Tuesday, January 10, 2012 2:47 PM
    Tuesday, January 10, 2012 2:44 PM
  • Why it can't be "optional" to let me use a real Start Menu and Desktop interface versus the limited and disfunctional Metro interface is rather perplexing to me, but then Microsoft isn't interested in what I think and doesn't seem too interested in making Windows 8 flexible enough to fill both the touch tablet and desktop/laptop market and would appear to feel that desktops & laptops belong in the trash heap.


    MS doesn't care about this. Read the agro Statement of Sinofsky:

    We've seen some small amount of visceral feedback focused on "choice" or "disable"—a natural reaction to change,


    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"

    Tuesday, January 10, 2012 11:01 PM
  • Hello again. Thanks for your comments.

    I have been spending some more time and I have reaffirmed some new thoughts over Windows 8 and what I have said in my initial post above. First, I want to make it known that I am not out to bash the new Metro GUI, I think it is a leap forward and I am for gradual modernization and improved technological development with Windows operating systems. I thought the "options" I presented would do Windows 8 a long of good in the long run. "Change" and "options" go hand in hand and are not always in polar opposition to one another as from the quote Sinofsky is alluding to here. "Options" are not a hinderance to a good or service, but a sign of improvement and betterment of a good or service. Microsoft leadership needs to understand that. Hey, Microsoft leaders should learn that from Apple. ...and I am both a Microsoft and Apple supporter.   

    Anyways, I do like the Metro GUI considerably and I appreciate that Microsoft has kept the desktop of Windows 8 'similar' and 'familiar' to the Windows 7 GUI, except the start menu is missing. Those that rush to judgment from the perspective of the Metro GUI 'alone' have demonstrated and are happily surprised in how to works BY ITSELF. Yet, it is very limited and has basic computing functions BY ITSELF, yet effective for simple and common computing functions. The Metro GUI is practically an operating system of its own now that I have experienced it as 'separate' from the Windows desktop with its own GUI interactions. Those users that have only experienced the pre-Beta of the Metro GUI focus will give it praise on its own merit, especially if they are only using the programs apparently available to the Metro GUI ALONE; however there is a greater and larger picture I think that many have not experienced that I have begin to experience I wish to share. If you have third party licenses or developed your own programs for previous versions of Windows, you may wish to utilize them with Windows 8 naturally. Most Windows users do. There will be some problems with some of them with the new infused Metro GUI platform -- yes I have experienced this leaving the Metro GUI intact and running. Yes, third party program developers have their programming work in head of them to come to terms with Windows 8. Even greater, there is now a serious user side ergonomic issue that is impractical and inefficient when a user wishes to have benefit of the Metro GUI and the desktop of Windows 8. With the start menu missing in order to maintain Metro GUI functionality from the perspective of Microsoft, a user who wishes to install third party applications or programs into Windows 8 (at such time when third party program developers have resurrected compatibility of their applications and programs with Windows 8) will have to interface with the Metro GUI to run their prospective programs due to the lack of the start menu inherent with the Windows desktop. Experiencing this first-hand, I find it EXTREMELY inefficient and impractical in order to launch a program. By maintaining the start menu, programs and other various functions directly off the desktop like WIndows 7 and previous Windows versions is MUCH MORE EFFICIENT AND PRACTICAL on the desktop interface, then to have to return all the way out to the Metro GUI. I think Microsoft wants its users to gets familiarly acclimated with the Metro GUI and not have to resort back to the 'old style' start menu feeling this may never 'advance' the further development of Windows or some other Windows evolution  -- that is why the start menu was eliminated I believe. However, ergonomically, this is absolutely foolish thought perception on the part of Microsoft. This issue alone will cause serious controversy and strong dislike with Windows 8, especially when the Windows novice users first interact with this inadequacy. This will have an extremely undesirable view of Windows 8 as I do now if they are not more inclusive with the user interactions! It is not a matter to wean he baby off the bottle, but what is sensible, practical, and efficient utilization! I HIGHLY and STRONGLY URGE Microsoft to RESTORE the start menu as part of the Windows 8's desktop "AND" still have the capability of having the Metro GUI available to users -- not an either 'or' situation. There is a time and a place to utilize the Metro GUI and there is a time and a place to use the Windows desktop of Windows 8 --both will get fairly utilized to most users; but a practical, sensible, and efficient practices especially need to be maintained as well for Windows success. I still stick with my original comments in my first post that customizable options of the new feature functions of Windows 8 would solve this issue I present now and more. I am here to help Microsoft with beneficial input, not to discredit and troll Microsoft -- but by being justifiably honest and sincere. Microsoft is still in the development phase pre-Beta phase of the Windows 8 and I hope developer preview input will rethink to restore the missing start menu back to the desktop and still maintain functionality the Metro GUI.                       



    Thursday, January 12, 2012 9:40 PM
  • We are getting into apps age, all the teenagers and kids are using "smartphone or tablets" with apps. Windows is doing a smart move trying to centralize and connect everything you need with one click. I been using WDP for a while,  for me is getting more easier to choose what i need to used, in the moment i need it.

    After Start Menu configuration for user and application they often use get A LOT simple. You imagine not to used the search because you have a lot of stuff in the start menu or have you desktop full of shortcuts all the time.

    This is only about time when windows install the operator system in there retail machine and we start buying new computer we going to get use to it.

    Friday, January 13, 2012 12:01 AM
  • Hello. The Metro GUI does have its benefits for quicker, faster, and easier access similar to common “apps” much like my smartphone. However, understand that the Metro GUI is a crude or elementary means to access your applications and cannot begin to measure the more phosticated and percisioned program functions and settings need that the basic Metro GUI interaction cannot perform and deliver. For example, my Creative sound card software has many files/folders and sub-files and folders of the software's functions demonstrated on the classic start menu that the Metro GUI would abliderate. Another fact is that like most users who edit photos or movies professionally needs the nuance of specialized controls that only a Windows desktop with the applicable programs interface can provide like using a program we all know too well, Photoshop or even Photoshop Elements. This can not be done with Metro GUI -- too basic a design scheme. The Metro GUI has its useful place, but it can not take the place of the Windows Desktop nor it ever should. Both are useful and I agree with their prospective rolls, but the notion that the Metro GUI will take over the traditional Windows Desktop is nonsense as I have been reading online. I think the crazed hysteria with the popular smartphone and the "apps" is causing too much paranoia at the moment -- checking their smartphones on average 150 times a day from a reported radio news program. I sure don't. Like I said, the Metro GUI does have its benefits like opening a web browser quick, but like anything users will realize the importance of the Windows Desktop for its other practical uses as well.

     

    My only concern is the direction or emphasis Microsoft plans to finalize Windows 8. If I use the Windows 8 desktop which I will most of the time, I would like to see the start menu restored for ease of access to programs on the desktop and still have the Metro GUI accessible without having to run that absolute registry modification in order to achieve one or the other. I would also like to get some of the benefits of Windows 8 technological improvements over Windows 7 as well and still have the Windows Desktop start menu. When I am working in the Windows 8 desktop without having to select “0” with the little known registry modification to get my Windows Desktop start menu back, however not loosing those Windows 8 technological improvements I have stated in my first post above. That is my concern -- not so absolute and rigid programming on the part of Microsoft and therefore less restrictive -- but with options.

    Friday, January 13, 2012 10:07 AM

  • My only concern is the direction or emphasis Microsoft plans to finalize Windows 8. If I use the Windows 8 desktop which I will most of the time, I would like to see the start menu restored for ease of access to programs on the desktop

    bad news:

    Server come with Metro Start Screen, old start menu is kicked from the code.

    http://winunleaked.tk/2012/01/windows-server-code-named-8-beta/


    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"

    Friday, January 13, 2012 6:52 PM
  • Here is my concern...

     

    ...if Microsoft finally concludes to NOT have the start menu restored for Windows 8 retail release AND EVEN eliminates that registry modification trick that is now present with the Developer Preview version, the complaint factor is going to be "overwhelming HUGE" when Windows 8 final release hits the market! Windows 8 will be deemed a "failure" like Windows Vista or even worse. That start menu is going to be a large percentage of the complaints. Microsoft will have to ultimately end up with a revision with say Windows 9 to bring back and modify to improve Windows quality like chiefly Windows 7 did from the poor image of Windows Vista. By word-of-mouth and published articles will tell Windows consumers to stay with Windows 8, much like users stayed with Windows XP when Windows Vista came to the market. I can forecast this happening if Microsoft leadership does not these simple fixes NOW to Windows 8. I am just trying to save Microsoft a lot of trouble NOW! I can then see Windows 7 the populist replacement for Windows XP for several years too.

    Let us hope they at least keep that registry modification trick in place with the Windows 8 final release. At least it will make it possible for the Windows desktop users like chiefly the business users and others who use Windows by leaving the registry modification trick present. At least we have an simple optional out to get their Windows desktop start menu back, but without the new Windows 8 feature functions. The only problem is the business market will not have consistent use of the new Metro GUI technology that is available since they would have to consistently have to perform that inconvenient registry hack they would deem "a royal pain in the butt" each time they have to go back and forth between the two 'separate' flavors of Windows 8. Time will tell what Microsoft will do.

    I have to say Windows 8 has some attributes that will be good for tablet computers with its Metro GUI, but many analysts believe Microsoft has already lost this market to Apple. I would say this 'relatively' true at this time. Not saying that Microsoft may become successful at some measure; but Apple still maintaining the edge in this particular market. My concern is when Microsoft attempts to distance and lessen the established and respected functional quality of the Windows desktop and operating system (for the most part -- I know some of you can argue that fact, but Windows has been 'relatively' successful) that built Microsoft in trying to chase Apples tablet market is just ludicrous on the part of how far Microsoft will go. When you have a successful product, you do not lessen it by ANY means -- it keep it going and STILL improve upon its strengths. When a company does not practice these simple values sets any company up for failure. Yes, you consistently strengthen you successes and always explore new markets too.          


    Friday, January 13, 2012 10:43 PM
  • Let us hope they at least keep that registry modification trick in place with the Windows 8 final release.


    nope, the trick was only added to hide Metro during the development (Red Pill, that's why it is named RPEnabled) when MS released Builds to OEMs. Now, MS removed all the code to hide metro and metro is always on.
    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"

    Saturday, January 14, 2012 10:23 PM
  • I have 2 versions of this software.. and I am scared to use the other as I was unable to back up the ISO before major crash of win 8 so I set the drive aside.

    at any rate there registry's are very different.

     

    Remember where there is a will there is a way..

    I imagine what will occur is a major "You Know what" to reinstate features like MPEG-2 and AVCHD if Microsoft removes those features.

    and the red Pill hack has been removed. Oh note on the one version I have all I have to do is key in one number and it changes the entire code .where as this version requires more peeking and poking and a few out right jabs and punches to the reg.


    Oh and there shouldn't be any issues with people wanting to have things there way.
    and I see it as no threat to MS for people to run either Metro or non metro feature
    • Edited by ASUSTUV4x Sunday, January 15, 2012 12:03 AM
    Sunday, January 15, 2012 12:01 AM
  • Why it can't be "optional" to let me use a real Start Menu and Desktop interface versus the limited and disfunctional Metro interface is rather perplexing to me, but then Microsoft isn't interested in what I think and doesn't seem too interested in making Windows 8 flexible enough to fill both the touch tablet and desktop/laptop market and would appear to feel that desktops & laptops belong in the trash heap.


    MS doesn't care about this. Read the agro Statement of Sinofsky:

    We've seen some small amount of visceral feedback focused on "choice" or "disable"—a natural reaction to change,


    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"


    OH MS WILL CARE when people mass in huge numbers ago to other products.
    Sunday, January 15, 2012 8:23 PM
  • Thanks for your update to Microsoft's desires on this issue, Andre.Ziegler: 

    I have been thinking after the fact and see there may be a silver lining to this issue with many Windows saviors out there...

    ...you will find third party developers and programmers develop a code and in essence create programs that restores "in the vision" of the prospective third party developer and programmer feature functions that have been removed from Windows 8, like the start menu. Actually, there are out now like a user customizable start menu. I can see them getting quite the popularity in the near future if you know what I mean. I say "in the vision" is because it will be designed and developed in the mind of the developer and programmer and 'may' function slightly different from the Microsoft's inherent functional feature(s) we all know now with Windows operating systems. I am thinking this inevitably "WILL" COME TRUE! These third party programs (free and pay) will be in HIGH demand, obviously.     

    ...and these third party developers and programmers WILL "SAVE" Microsoft's butt from serious fallout!!! ...but only to 'some degree' for those willing to install the third party programs to restore some of the similar Windows desktop-like functions. Microsoft will still get a bad rap on some of these 'serious' practical, sensible, and reasonable Windows Desktop system modifications losses regardless for knowingly done it.     

     


    Tuesday, January 17, 2012 5:29 AM
  • Why it can't be "optional" to let me use a real Start Menu and Desktop interface versus the limited and disfunctional Metro interface is rather perplexing to me, but then Microsoft isn't interested in what I think and doesn't seem too interested in making Windows 8 flexible enough to fill both the touch tablet and desktop/laptop market and would appear to feel that desktops & laptops belong in the trash heap.


    MS doesn't care about this. Read the agro Statement of Sinofsky:

    We've seen some small amount of visceral feedback focused on "choice" or "disable"—a natural reaction to change,


    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"


    OH MS WILL CARE when people mass in huge numbers ago to other products.

    Yes, you are correct... ...this DOES OFTEN HAPPEN with its customer base! ...then Microsoft will be scrambling again like they did with Windows Vista I strongly assume. What happens or what they decide to do is anyone's guess after that. But in the interim, I can see what is likely to be ahead for Windows 8. Once users get past the oohs and aahs of the neat and cool Metro GUI (and don't get me wrong that is neat and it is practical in its own right), Microsoft will 'fairly' (and not just from trolls out there that are mostly Apple lovers) see the negative reviewed perception of Windows 8 from similar viewpoints I have addressed here.      



    Tuesday, January 17, 2012 5:47 AM