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bookmarks problem RRS feed

  • Question

  • I use ew 2 for making a website. I try to link a selection on one web page with another one in the same file. That works fine but when i try to link the selection to a bookmarked section on another page where there may be 3 to 4 bookmarks it doesn't work. There is no directions in Jim Chesires book on linking to a bookmark on a different web page so I had to go back to using frontpage 2003 for doing it and it may take me to one bookmark but when i try the other bookmarked choices on that page the selections for the others take me to only one, the same bookmark. Why doesn't a book like Cheshire's show me how to do this so I must go back and use frontpage? I can work a little with the coding but if you tell me to starting entering or changing alot of code I won't be able to do it.
    Sunday, August 29, 2010 9:49 PM

Answers

  • First:  Get rid of all that <o:p></o:p> - it's nonsense that means nothing to browsers.  Old FrontPage junk, or pasting from Word.

    Second: What is "WB2"?

    For

    <strong><a name="adult"></a>Diets For Adult Dogs</strong>

    The bookmark takes no space, and you may not see the dashed line.  If you had selected the words, the bookmark would be coded as

    <strong><a name="adult">Diets For Adult Dogs</a></strong> and you'd see the dashed line under them.

    Now, I don't know what you mean by that code sending you to the bookmark on another page: it won't send you anywhere.  It's not a link, but a bookmark.  There is no href.

    <strong><a name="adult"></a><a name="adult" href="#adult">Diets For Adult Dogs</a></strong><o:p></o:p></span></p>

    Look at what you have there: you have put two bookmarks named "adult" in, and one of them is a link that also links to itself, the "adult" bookmark on that page.

    At least two of those "adult" references are not needed or  are wrong.

    As for the rest: I can't follow what you say is happening in browsers.  You need to publish your pages and give us a link for us to see it in action.

    Monday, August 30, 2010 5:30 PM
  • I looked at the tutorial and it did not go far enough to help me. I noticed that there is a new version of Expression Web 4 instead of the 2 that I have and it has a Expression Web SEO Checker on it that looks like all that I would need to help me eliminate the problems.

    ???
    No, it won't be. SEO stands for Search Engine Optimization, and the SEO tool in EW4 is designed to point out specific areas where your pages are missing something (or have something) that is not optimized for indexing by search engines. It does not, and cannot, clean up clunky, deprecated markup. That is something that must be done by hand, with the very handy assistance of EW's squiggly underlines and yellow highlighting for errors in markup.

    Will this work as well as trying to learn CSS and work my way into making a web page?

    No, it will not, and that is the wrong approach to take anyway. As stated above, first by Kathy and then belabored by me, there is no magic tool to transform ____ markup into compliant, semantic markup. And just what is so wrong with learning, anyway? Learnng is a kick! It's exciting, exhilarating, empowering, and IMO, the most fun you can have with your clothes on.

    Learn CSS and HTML and you'll never have to worry again about which tool you use. You'll be able to do whatever you want using whichever tool you want, with the only difference between them being the gimcrackery and the bells and whistles.

    I see that upgrades are available using Web 4. Can I use this to up grade my Web 2? Thanks for your help.

    EW4 is a free upgrade to (most) owners of EW3 (to all owners of retail versions, AFAIK). It is a very inexpensive upgrade from EW2, at $79 for Expression Web, Expression Encoder, and Expression Design all three.

    But, be realistic in your expectations. It is still Expression Web, with a few more bells and whistles such as SuperPreview and Snapshot, the SEO checker, an extensibility model, etc. At its core, it is still a professional-level Web development tool, however, and you still do need to understand HTML and CSS to be effective using it.

    Here's the thing: There has been, there is not now, nor, I suspect, will there ever be a second coming of FrontPage. It's time to get over it, learn some basics (c'mon, millions of other people do it!), and move forward. You won't regret it.

    cheers,
    scott


    C'mon, folks. This isn't rocket science, nor neurosurgery. It's "Expression" (singular) "Web" (singular), in that order, followed by a version numeral if you wish to be specific. It is often abbreviated "EW." It is not "Web Expression," "Expressions Web," "Web Expressions," or plain "Expression" or "Expressions." Not using the correct name indicates either ignorance or laziness. Most folks would rather avoid the appearance of either.
    Tuesday, August 31, 2010 7:39 PM

All replies

  • For linking to a bookmark on a different page, it is an easy process and uses very minimal code.  This procedure is using the GUI, but you can see the code if you use the design/split view.


    From your question it seems you already know these procedures, but are getting stuck on the issue with the hyperlink jumping back to the same spot even when you choose different bookmarks.  Therefore, can you do a test with the instructions given below to see if you still get the same problem.

    Step 1:
    This is similar to making a normal hyperlink; on the page you want to link to (example:  test2.html ), select the text to become your bookmark,  go to INSERT menu choose option called BOOKMARK.  Give the bookmark a name (e.g. "joebloggs").  You should see the code, something like:

    <a name="joebloggs">Joe Bloggs</a></p>

    In Design view you will see it in design view indicated by "Joe Bloggs" with a dotted underline, indicating the bookmark itself.


    Step 2

    In the page you want to link from (example: test1.html) , select the text that will be the actual link to the second page, to the bookmark named "joebloggs"; go to INSERT menu, choose HYPERLINK.   Select the page to link to (i.e. test2.html) as you would for any other hyperlink.  In the same Hyperlink dialogue box, click the button labelled "Bookmarks..."  Choose the bookmark you previously created "joebloggs".  Save the settings.  In the design view, the link will turn blue (or as set in your CSS).  The code will look like:

    <a href="test2.html#joebloggs">Click here to read about Joe Bloggs</a>

    Repeat the instructions to make further bookmarks/links.

    Can you provide a link to the page(s) so we can check the code as I can't explain why when you choose different bookmark choices, it links/jumps back to the same place in the linked page without seeing your page's code.



    Andrew M


    http://www.murraywebs.com

    "Nothing spoils numbers faster than arithmetic!"
    -- Peppermint Patty (Peanuts, Charles M. Schulz)
    • Proposed as answer by AndrewOZ1 Monday, August 30, 2010 9:34 AM
    Sunday, August 29, 2010 10:49 PM
  • Steve, you might want to re-read the OP's post.  He's talking about bookmarks on another page not working, saying bookmarks on the same page work.

    Monday, August 30, 2010 12:19 AM
  • oops
    Expression Web MVP
    Monday, August 30, 2010 4:16 PM
  • Thank you for your replies. The following is the code on the index page that sends me to the bookmark on another page as entered in WB2; it looks the same when entered using Frontpage:

    <li><a href="feeding_a_normal_dog_or_cat.html#adult">Normal Adults</a></li>

    The following is the code on the the destination page, a different web page, that sends me to the bookmark on another page as entered in WB2:

    <strong><a name="adult"></a>Diets For Adult Dogs</strong><o:p></o:p></span></p>

    The following is the code on the the destination page, a different web page, that sends me to the bookmark on another page as entered in Frontpage:

    <strong><a name="adult"></a><a name="adult" href="#adult">Diets For Adult Dogs</a></strong><o:p></o:p></span></p>

    It works in Frontpage and not in WB2. Also when I bookmark using WB2 on the second page the dashed line under the bookmarked word doesn't always show up.

    I know now that I can use Frontpage to solve my problem but WB2 cannot be used for what I am trying to do. Also the directions to do this in Cheshire's book are nonexistent so is this a place where WB2 doesn't allow one to do this unless one goes in and enters the code to get it done?

    Monday, August 30, 2010 4:48 PM
  • Read the message I sent a few minutes ago. I discovered that the problem is present when I use Mozilla Foxfire as the browser to check the site but it is not present when I test it in Internet explorer 8. Is there something I can do for this?
    Monday, August 30, 2010 5:07 PM
  • First:  Get rid of all that <o:p></o:p> - it's nonsense that means nothing to browsers.  Old FrontPage junk, or pasting from Word.

    Second: What is "WB2"?

    For

    <strong><a name="adult"></a>Diets For Adult Dogs</strong>

    The bookmark takes no space, and you may not see the dashed line.  If you had selected the words, the bookmark would be coded as

    <strong><a name="adult">Diets For Adult Dogs</a></strong> and you'd see the dashed line under them.

    Now, I don't know what you mean by that code sending you to the bookmark on another page: it won't send you anywhere.  It's not a link, but a bookmark.  There is no href.

    <strong><a name="adult"></a><a name="adult" href="#adult">Diets For Adult Dogs</a></strong><o:p></o:p></span></p>

    Look at what you have there: you have put two bookmarks named "adult" in, and one of them is a link that also links to itself, the "adult" bookmark on that page.

    At least two of those "adult" references are not needed or  are wrong.

    As for the rest: I can't follow what you say is happening in browsers.  You need to publish your pages and give us a link for us to see it in action.

    Monday, August 30, 2010 5:30 PM
  • I don't know if you got my reply. My error was in not beginning the bookmarks in the links and in the bookmark itself with the same case letter. I also wonder if it is important to clean all the junk out of my code for best performance. Does Expressions Web 2 have an option to do this? I appreciate all your help. Thank you.
    Monday, August 30, 2010 6:53 PM
  • There is no magic option to clean out the FrontPage/Word junk.

    Frankly, the easiest thing to do (a page at a time, as you have the time to do it), might be to start a fresh page in EW, and move the images and text content over (just the text, not the style stuff around it), and create your own new styles in an attached CSS sheet in EW.  You'd get a page that was up to modern standards, and could make it look like the old one (or better, if you like, of course). 

    But don't do that until you've been through the "Before Posting" References, and understand how to use EW and CSS well.  The Basic Site tutorial is a "must do", if you haven't already.

    Monday, August 30, 2010 7:30 PM
  • I looked at the tutorial and it did not go far enough to help me. I noticed that there is a new version of Expression Web 4 instead of the 2 that I have and it has a Expression Web SEO Checker on it that looks like all that I would need to help me eliminate the problems. Will this work as well as trying to learn CSS and work my way into making a web page? I see that upgrades are available using Web 4. Can I use this to up grade my Web 2? Thanks for your help.
    Tuesday, August 31, 2010 5:21 PM
  • I looked at the tutorial and it did not go far enough to help me. I noticed that there is a new version of Expression Web 4 instead of the 2 that I have and it has a Expression Web SEO Checker on it that looks like all that I would need to help me eliminate the problems.

    ???
    No, it won't be. SEO stands for Search Engine Optimization, and the SEO tool in EW4 is designed to point out specific areas where your pages are missing something (or have something) that is not optimized for indexing by search engines. It does not, and cannot, clean up clunky, deprecated markup. That is something that must be done by hand, with the very handy assistance of EW's squiggly underlines and yellow highlighting for errors in markup.

    Will this work as well as trying to learn CSS and work my way into making a web page?

    No, it will not, and that is the wrong approach to take anyway. As stated above, first by Kathy and then belabored by me, there is no magic tool to transform ____ markup into compliant, semantic markup. And just what is so wrong with learning, anyway? Learnng is a kick! It's exciting, exhilarating, empowering, and IMO, the most fun you can have with your clothes on.

    Learn CSS and HTML and you'll never have to worry again about which tool you use. You'll be able to do whatever you want using whichever tool you want, with the only difference between them being the gimcrackery and the bells and whistles.

    I see that upgrades are available using Web 4. Can I use this to up grade my Web 2? Thanks for your help.

    EW4 is a free upgrade to (most) owners of EW3 (to all owners of retail versions, AFAIK). It is a very inexpensive upgrade from EW2, at $79 for Expression Web, Expression Encoder, and Expression Design all three.

    But, be realistic in your expectations. It is still Expression Web, with a few more bells and whistles such as SuperPreview and Snapshot, the SEO checker, an extensibility model, etc. At its core, it is still a professional-level Web development tool, however, and you still do need to understand HTML and CSS to be effective using it.

    Here's the thing: There has been, there is not now, nor, I suspect, will there ever be a second coming of FrontPage. It's time to get over it, learn some basics (c'mon, millions of other people do it!), and move forward. You won't regret it.

    cheers,
    scott


    C'mon, folks. This isn't rocket science, nor neurosurgery. It's "Expression" (singular) "Web" (singular), in that order, followed by a version numeral if you wish to be specific. It is often abbreviated "EW." It is not "Web Expression," "Expressions Web," "Web Expressions," or plain "Expression" or "Expressions." Not using the correct name indicates either ignorance or laziness. Most folks would rather avoid the appearance of either.
    Tuesday, August 31, 2010 7:39 PM
  • "I looked at the tutorial and it did not go far enough to help me."

    The tutorial is how to use EW to create new pages/sites.  It is not how to clean up old stuff.  It applies if you use my suggestion to create a new page rather than try and clean up an old page, an option that is likely to be faster than trying to clean up FrontPage code, once you understand how to create a good page in EW.

    Tuesday, August 31, 2010 9:03 PM
  • My concern was how to clean up code that came in with the text I produced in Microsoft Word. I was able to clean out all the "meso" stuff by bringing the web pages in Dreamweaver and it has an operation to clean out this kind of extra code that is not needed. Thanks
    Tuesday, August 31, 2010 9:51 PM
  • Donald,

    Thanks for that mention of Dreamweaver and Frontpage code clean up, I was not aware of it. I went to the Adobe site and see some 60K plus downloads for the "cleanup Frontpage code" tool. It looks a bit dated (02) so I wonder if it works with FP03 and with DWCs5- have you actually used it?

    I have CS5 and lots and lots of FP sites to try and "save" so I am real interested in your results and I am not against using DW or anything else that can help.

    Having such a function in EW seems natural and I have brought it up before but it does not seem to be a popular concept for some reason. I wish MS or somebody would consider it for EW- it seems strange to use DW to fix and FP issue rather than EW.

    It seems 60 thousand downloads of a Dreamweaver extension to fix Frontpage sites might indicate something about demand and the likelyhood some of those downloaders end up staying with that tool. I like EW but would like to see some effort to support former customers with FP, please let us know if Dreamweaver saved your situation and how easy (or difficult) the process is. 

    I wonder if someone could build an add on for some of those FP issues for EW since MS does not seem interested, seems like it could be a good seller. 

    Tuesday, August 31, 2010 10:50 PM
  • Bob, you might want to take a closer look at that extension, or since you have the raw material to work with (I left FP a decade ago), download and install it and try it out. Be sure to have realistic expectations, if the description accurately reflects what it can and cannot do...

    "Remove extraneous code - such as WebBots, navigation-related comments and META tags - which are all added by FrontPage. This extension can run on individual pages or an entire site. It removes extraneous code including: proprietary tags, data and comments inserted by Microsoft FrontPage and presents a report detailing what has been done. You can specify which areas of the code will be cleaned up."

    Conspicuously absent from those lists of what it can clean up are all of the non-proprietary, but nonetheless deprecated markup and inline HTML properties that FP routinely used to style elements. There would still be a good deal of work to be done when that tool is finished. It is at least reasonably arguable that the amount left to be done might be as great as or greater than what it would take to simply rebuild from scratch using current, compliant methods. And that is without taking into consideration the havoc that might be wreaked by the tool itself.

    Consider these elements which would be removed: WebBots, navigation-related comments. Now, that's just fine, no doubt about it. But, what if some or all of the site still uses shared borders, or even design-time includes (which require webbot comments)? If the developer has not already replaced the FP-specific navigation elements by employing a DWT or other solution, he is then faced with that task with a site that no longer works. And anything that requires a webbot comment is history (including, one must assume, the includes, whose content presumably simply vanishes), while you are left with all of the inline font tags and other deprecated HTML that FP produced as a matter of course.

    I'm not saying don't try it. In fact, I encourage you to do so. Of all of us here you are probably the single person most able to trial the extension to see what it will do. From your own statements, you have DW CS5 and 'lots and lots of FP sites to try and "save,"' so it would appear that you would have both the best opportunity and the most to gain by finding out if such a tool can actually achieve the objective of bringing old FP sites into the modern, standards-compliant world. Please do so, and let us know what you learn.

    cheers,
    scott


    C'mon, folks. This isn't rocket science, nor neurosurgery. It's "Expression" (singular) "Web" (singular), in that order, followed by a version numeral if you wish to be specific. It is often abbreviated "EW." It is not "Web Expression," "Expressions Web," "Web Expressions," or plain "Expression" or "Expressions." Not using the correct name indicates either ignorance or laziness. Most folks would rather avoid the appearance of either.
    Wednesday, September 1, 2010 3:10 AM
  • It really isn't that difficult to get rid of FP's bad code and you don't need Dreamweaver to do it.

    Copy-Paste as HTML plain text gets rid of it completely then a few clicks and you have your structure back. Others use gmail to clean their pages. Pat & Tina use macros (and teach people how to create a clean-up toolbar in v1-2) to get rid of extraneous FP code.

    FWIW, Dreamweaver does only slightly better than highlighing the whole page and using "Remove Formatting" under Format > Remove Formatting.


    MS MVP Expression Tutorials & Help http://by-expression.com
    Wednesday, September 1, 2010 3:49 AM
  • Absolutely! There are several ways to rid an FP-built page of deprecated and/or proprietary markup, all of which leave the structure intact. It is then up to the developer to create the necessary CSS to replace the junk, deprecated FP markup, and to style the page to look as it was meant to. And that's not even taking into account the possible replacement of non-semantic and SEO-unfriendly table structuring with semantic, hierarchically relevant structuring using correctly employed headings, lists, etc. and semantically-neutral containers such as spans and divs.

    I'm not saying that there aren't ways to clean up FP code. Rather, simply that in the end, for any moderately complex layout created with FP, the work required to clean up after the clean-up may easily be greater than what would be required to rebuild from scratch. And that doesn't even take into consideration the effort needed to replace FP-specific navigation and other bots if they were employed.

    In the end, TANSTAAFL, whether it's a DW extension or built-in feature, or methods that can be applied using other tools such as EW. To transform an FP page into a standards-compliant, accessible, cross-platform compatible page will require time and knowledge of HTML and CSS, no matter what tool or method one wishes to employ.

    To me, the hardest part of the job is done—the design concept and the content are already there. Given layout objective, content, and images, any page created by FP can be replicated in less than an evening, with time for out for dinner and a sojourn with the SO. It would take more time to pick over the remnants of an automated cleanup and work with what was left than it would to simply rebuild the thing from the git-go if you had all the pieces already in place. That's all I'm saying...

    cheers,
    scott


    C'mon, folks. This isn't rocket science, nor neurosurgery. It's "Expression" (singular) "Web" (singular), in that order, followed by a version numeral if you wish to be specific. It is often abbreviated "EW." It is not "Web Expression," "Expressions Web," "Web Expressions," or plain "Expression" or "Expressions." Not using the correct name indicates either ignorance or laziness. Most folks would rather avoid the appearance of either.
    Wednesday, September 1, 2010 4:50 AM
  • We have thousands of pages over multiple sites and would benifit from any automation available when cleaning up FP created sites. We already started the easy stuff by getting rid of shared borders and junk related to bots (except includes) and relaced page structures with DWT's.

    Since we are looking at possibly thousands of hours work no matter what aproach taken it seems anything that helps must be considered. Regarding depricated tags- thats another matter.

    Cheryl: Can you tell me more about your reference to using GMail for this- Thats new to me. 

     

     

    Wednesday, September 1, 2010 1:05 PM
  • Bob,

    I cannot because I do not have a gmail account nor do I ever plan on having one due to privacy concerns. It has been mentioned in various threads here but I couldn't tell you which ones.

    Problem with automated solutions is that they can break pages pretty easily. Pat & Tina have an ebook on their method using search queries to clean up FP sites. How well it would work on a site with thousands of pages I don't know but it has been used on sites with hundreds of pages (or so I recall from one of the classes.)


    MS MVP Expression Tutorials & Help http://by-expression.com
    Wednesday, September 1, 2010 1:58 PM
  • Might be referring to this method:

    http://www.veign.com/blog/2008/10/06/convert-a-word-document-to-html-easy-and-free/

     

    I've used this method several times to create HTML documents from complex documents that we're stored in Word.  Gmail converts lots of documents and provides a clean base of code to build from.


    --
    Chris Hanscom - Microsoft MVP
    On Facebook | On Twitter | Resource Center | Veign's Blog | Web Development Help

    Get a Complete Website Analysis by Veign
    Wednesday, September 1, 2010 2:21 PM
  • The clean up function in Dreamweaver removed alot that wasn't necessary; they give a list of everything that was removed. I have only two problems with the results. One is that on the tables I have the removal included all the dividing lines in the tables. But that is minor because I can replace those easily. The other is that the removal created double spaces in the recipes I have in the site. They are spaces that I cannot remove and the only way to fix it is to create a single space box with the shift-return function. Cutting and pasting will be alot of work unless there is an easier way to solve this problem. I cannot use any of the change line spacing functions to solve this and I cannot see anything in the code that directs the program to now put in a double space where I previously had a single space. Thanks for the help from all of you.
    Wednesday, September 1, 2010 4:23 PM
  • It sounds as if it changed what were multi-line blocks, with <br> newlines (or naturally wrapped without newlines), into paragraphs. Just a guess since we can't see the actual before/after markup. If so, you've got a good deal of work ahead of you...

    One thing you can try, if that is the case, is using a contextual selector to remove or modify the default top and bottom margins of the <p> elements within the cells, something like

    td p {
       margin:3px 0;
    }

    That would affect only paragraphs within table cell containers.

    cheers,
    scott

     


    C'mon, folks. This isn't rocket science, nor neurosurgery. It's "Expression" (singular) "Web" (singular), in that order, followed by a version numeral if you wish to be specific. It is often abbreviated "EW." It is not "Web Expression," "Expressions Web," "Web Expressions," or plain "Expression" or "Expressions." Not using the correct name indicates either ignorance or laziness. Most folks would rather avoid the appearance of either.
    Wednesday, September 1, 2010 5:41 PM
  • Search and Replace across all pages should do it.

    Highlight the junk you want to change, and when you open Replace, EW has already filled that in in the Look For box. Choose the right options and let EW work its magic.


    Some see the glass as half full. Others see the glass as half empty. I see a glass that's clearly twice as large as it needs to be.
    Thursday, September 2, 2010 1:37 AM
  • That works fine when you're looking for individual strings to replace/remove. It's problematic if the conversion has wrapped what used to be multi-line text with newlines with paragraph tags for each individual line.

    Unfortunately, the OP hasn't reported back what actually happened, nor graced us with a link so we can check for ourselves, so I guess we'll just have to wait to see what the situation is when he checks back in...

    cheers,
    scott


    C'mon, folks. This isn't rocket science, nor neurosurgery. It's "Expression" (singular) "Web" (singular), in that order, followed by a version numeral if you wish to be specific. It is often abbreviated "EW." It is not "Web Expression," "Expressions Web," "Web Expressions," or plain "Expression" or "Expressions." Not using the correct name indicates either ignorance or laziness. Most folks would rather avoid the appearance of either.
    Thursday, September 2, 2010 1:57 AM