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lots of APPCRASH in Windows 8 Developer Preview (old PCs)

    Question

  • I was very happy with W8 32bits in my laptop (Core2 Duo T6000 64bit, ATI HD4530, 4Gb RAM) so I wanted to try it in my old PC expecting the same success (Athlon XP 2800+ (socket A, mmx, SSE, 3Dnow!), 2Gb DDR 400 Dual Channel, Asus ATI HD3450 AGP)

    I have to say this old PC is also running Windows 7 SP1 without any problems or crashes.

    After installing W8 the first thing I did was right click on Computer-> Manage and the application crashed. After some days of use the number of crashes did keep increasing. If I run services.msc it crash, the same with eventvwr.msc, Scripted Diagnostics Native Host, ngentask.exe, WinRAR setup, Mipony... etc

    So I went to see reliability history (awesome tool) and found the culprit of almost all my crashes in two files: clr.dll and d3d10warp.dll
    First one is a .Net framework file so I tried to reinstall .Net v4 without luck as now is part of the o.s. Second one seems is from DirectX so I also updated it but the crashes continue. I tried new graphics drivers or safe mode without luck. Finally I also tried in another old computer (Sempron 3000+, 512Mb DDR, Nvidia Geforce4) and the same crashes appeared like in my PC.
    So I suspect Windows Developer Preview doesn't run well with some old CPUs. Both PCs with crashes have a CPU socket A and lack important instructions like SSE2. Can you please confirm this?



    • Edited by Jonathan8086 Wednesday, September 21, 2011 4:04 PM
    Wednesday, September 21, 2011 4:01 PM

Answers

All replies

  • What graphic drivers are you using? If you are able to reach Windows Update, try to update them. If you already have them, try to rollback to the generic driver.
    Wednesday, September 21, 2011 4:38 PM
  • What graphic drivers are you using? If you are able to reach Windows Update, try to update them. If you already have them, try to rollback to the generic driver.

    Right now I'm using the latest Catalyst Hotfix as is an AGP card. But I don't think is a driver problem because I tried everything: Windows update driver, Basic driver, old and new Catalyst, safe mode... Also Windows 7SP1 works perfectly in the same computer.

    Also the other computer with nvidia Geforce4 has the same problems. But for that there is not even a Vista compatible driver. (only XP and didn't work)

     

    Wednesday, September 21, 2011 4:57 PM
  • please download this reg file from my SkyDrive:

    http://cid-128fc518635be2dc.office.live.com/self.aspx/.Public/MS%20Foren/Registry/LocalDumps.reg

    and make a double click on the file to import it.

    When an application crashes, Windows Error Reporting Service [1] creates a dmp file under C:\Localdumps. Please upload the dump (zip it first) to your public Skydrive [2] folder and post the link here so that we and MSFT employees can look at the dumps.

    André

    [1] http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb787181%28VS.85%29.aspx
    [2] http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/w7itproui/thread/4fc10639-02db-4665-993a-08d865088d65


    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"

    Wednesday, September 21, 2011 10:20 PM
  • Thursday, September 22, 2011 12:24 AM
  • Thanks for uploading the dumps, Jonathan. Two of them unveiled a CLR issue that we're currently investigating.

     

    Cosmin

    CLR Team

    Thursday, September 22, 2011 4:42 PM
  • ok, I only saw that a Assembly loading issue occurs:

     clr!PsetCacheEntry::CreateManagedPsetObject

    clr!PsetCacheEntry::CreateManagedPsetObject
    5f1b47e7 5f              pop     edi
    5f1b47e8 5e              pop     esi
    5f1b47e9 c9              leave
    5f1b47ea c20400          ret     4
    clr!CrawlFrame::GetAssembly:

    so Cosmin is the right person for you.

    1 MMC crash (mmc.exe.2268.dmp) was caused by d3d10warp!ProcessorThreadSpecificData::ExecuteProgram_JIT+1a

    So this is an issue with the DirectX10 feature emulation. But your card should be DirectX10.1. Windows 8 comes with WDDM1.20 support, wait for a better driver from ATI.

     


    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"

    Thursday, September 22, 2011 5:51 PM
  • Thank you both. I hope the clr team can fix the clr.dll problem soon.


    About the d3d10warp.dll problem I think we can discard the graphics card or drivers.  I am testing in more PCs and the results are confirming my suspicions.  Every PC with AMD socket A processor (Athlon XP/Sempron that lack SSE2 instructions) will make programs like Services.msc crash in WDP.

    Today I tested an Athlon64 (has SSE2 support) with the same ATI graphics card and there are no crashes. Everything is working fine.


    There was a known bug in VS2010 (pre SP1) with Athlon XP processors:

    http://connect.microsoft.com/VisualStudio/feedback/details/565959

    It's like if d3dwarp.dll (and maybe clr.dll too) were compiled with that version.  Anyway I hope this can be fixed by the WDP Beta.



    • Edited by Jonathan8086 Wednesday, September 28, 2011 9:45 PM
    Wednesday, September 28, 2011 9:43 PM
  • Send it with the feedback tool and attach dumps which show the d3dwarp issue. Maybe MS used SSE2 to make the emulation faster.


    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"

    Thursday, September 29, 2011 12:17 PM
  • Done. Thanks a lot for the help.
    Thursday, September 29, 2011 11:46 PM
  • Hi Jonathan, it would be great if you could provide us with Time Travel Debugging trace for an mmc.exe crash. Also it'd be nice to have crash dump from the PageHeap verification http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ff549561(v=VS.85).aspx 

    Rajkumar

    CLR Team

    Friday, October 14, 2011 5:18 PM
  • Hi, the Windows Developer Preview x86 version doesn't have debugging tools included. If you can tell me where I can get the Time Travel Tracer program I'll gladly help.

    Friday, October 14, 2011 9:44 PM
  • Hi Jonathan, it would be great if you could provide us with Time Travel Debugging trace for an mmc.exe crash. Also it'd be nice to have crash dump from the PageHeap verification http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ff549561(v=VS.85).aspx 

    Rajkumar

    CLR Team

    Thanks Rajkumar, here you have 3 dumps with Full Page Heap enabled. I hope this can help to fix the crashes.

    https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=62a300c753c34ab2&sc=documents&uc=3&id=62A300C753C34AB2%21256

    Saturday, October 15, 2011 2:36 AM
  • Same problem here, almost everything crashes. On the IE crash i don't get a dump-file. On the mmc adding the EventViewer-Snap-In, I got this dump:

    https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=185b55f0f8a59b05&sc=documents&uc=1&id=185B55F0F8A59B05%21144#
    mmc.exe.3216.zip

    System: AMD Sempron 2,06 GHz; 2 GB Ram, Nvidia GeForceFX5200

    Thursday, October 27, 2011 7:00 PM
  • Will there be any fixing update someday for this? I still can't do anything on my machine because the only thing that won't crash is WindowsExplorer.
    Thursday, January 12, 2012 10:19 AM
  • Stay at your old Windows, the PC is very old. I can only see that the MMC crashes after inializing the .net Framework while loading an MMC Addin.

    Try it again with the Beta.


    "A programmer is just a tool which converts caffeine into code"

    Thursday, January 12, 2012 8:37 PM