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Does Winqual accept WER reports from Vista systems? RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hi all,

    we recently registered for the Winqual site. Reports are coming in about crashes in our application which occur on Windows XP systems, so it seems like the whole registration process worked as expected.

    However, we also ran our application (same version as on XP) on Vista, and provoked several crashes (same type of crashes as the ones on XP) there - but don't see *any* reports on the Winqual servers for those crashes.

    I've tried a lot of things already, but maybe I should check one fundamental thing first: Do the Winqual servers actually accept and process reports from Vista machines?

    BTW, I also noticed that reports from a Windows XP x64 system were apparently classified as "Windows 2003 Server" on Winqual. Is this normal?

    Thanks!

      Claus

    http://www.clausbrod.de


    • Moved by Max Wang_1983 Tuesday, April 26, 2011 5:34 PM forum consolidation (From:Windows Error Reporting for ISVs)
    Tuesday, June 12, 2007 5:12 PM

Answers

  •  

    Hi Claus,

     

    Yes, Vista does send crash reports. A quick check on our end shows 380 events with hits on Vista assigned to CoCreate Software.(I believe this is your company?) Sometimes there is a delay between when the crashes occur and on your machine and when they appear on the site. This usually only takes 1-2 days but can take as many as 4 days.

     

    Thanks for letting us know about the WinXP x64 version problem. The OSVersion of WinXP x64 is very close to that of Server 2003 so our patterns are off. We will update them shortly.

     

    Thanks,

    -Saar Picker

    Developer Portal - http://winqual.microsoft.com

     

    Wednesday, June 13, 2007 1:18 AM
  • Hi DHON,

     

    Mapping is explicit.  That is to say you are required to map each file you want data on.  If you have a new build you want to track, you need to upload a mapping file for that build.

    Presently, we match events to a company based on the name of the file, its Version, and linkdate (linkdate if possible).  We have processes that watch for cross company file mapping collisions and a team that manages file mapping collisions.  This team will engage all parties involved if we see a mapping collision, and we have a way to automatically decline or authorize a commonly mapped file across companies.

     

    Kind regards,

    -Jason 

     

     

    Wednesday, June 20, 2007 11:23 PM

All replies

  •  

    Hi Claus,

     

    Yes, Vista does send crash reports. A quick check on our end shows 380 events with hits on Vista assigned to CoCreate Software.(I believe this is your company?) Sometimes there is a delay between when the crashes occur and on your machine and when they appear on the site. This usually only takes 1-2 days but can take as many as 4 days.

     

    Thanks for letting us know about the WinXP x64 version problem. The OSVersion of WinXP x64 is very close to that of Server 2003 so our patterns are off. We will update them shortly.

     

    Thanks,

    -Saar Picker

    Developer Portal - http://winqual.microsoft.com

     

    Wednesday, June 13, 2007 1:18 AM
  • Saar,

    thanks a lot for your help, and for looking up the event stats! (And yes, you're right, I'm with CoCreate Software.)

    Last night, apparently a few more crash reports trickled in, and those were classified as coming from Windows Vista. However, the classification doesn't look right to me - the crash reports claim they were sent from Danish and Estonian versions of Windows Vista, which sounds pretty unlikely since so far we were running all our tests on US English versions of either XP or Vista. Also, the crash reports were for versions of our software which we didn't even use to run our tests on...

    Is there any way for us to access those 380 Vista-related reports for our products which we don't see on the Winqual site?

    Thanks!

    Claus

    http://www.clausbrod.de

    Wednesday, June 13, 2007 5:58 AM
  •  

    Claus,

     

    This is a situation where our filter feature would help. From the Product Rollup page, you can select the Product Eventlist for the produce you have mapped. It will return all events in the Product, 20 events at a time. Above the events, you will see a section called 'Show Filter' with a '+' next to it. Expand the section by clicking on the '+' and you can filter events by OS Version and by Language as well. If you would like to see Vista events across all your products, use the search feature with '*' as your search criteria. This will return all your events which you can then filter on.

     

    For your other questions, the reason why you events for other locales is that in many of your files the version  value is '0.0.0.0'. This makes it very difficult for us to determine which events belong to which product. Incrementing this value with each build or release will prevent this.

     

    Thanks,

    -Saar Picker

    Developer Portal - http://winqual.microsoft.com

     

    Wednesday, June 13, 2007 7:37 PM
  • Saar,

    I've tried the filter, but of the 380 Vista reports that you mentioned, I can only see two 8-(

    Claus

    Wednesday, June 13, 2007 8:43 PM
  •  

    Hi Claus,

     

    I appologize for my miscalculation. Some events were left over from mappings you had in the past but deleted. These do not appear on the site but appeared to me in the DB.

     

    I did discover a problem in our system that is preventing you from seeing 2 events (one has a Vista hit). As an event reoccurs over time these problems tend to resolve themselves. We will fix the cause of this problem in our next release. Your proper event count should be 11.

     

    As of today our site is current to 6/10/2007 so any events over the past 3 days have not yet shown up. If you like, I'd be happy to track specific event types for you and give you the status. It does seem, though, that for the most part you are seeing what information we have.

     

    Thanks,

    -Saar Picker

    Developer Portal - http://winqual.microsoft.com/

    Thursday, June 14, 2007 12:37 AM
  • Saar,

    thanks again for the update.

    Unfortunately, we're still not seeing the Vista reports which (we think) we have been sending to the Winqual site since almost a week now 8-(

      Claus

    http://www.clausbrod.de/Blog

    Friday, June 15, 2007 6:24 AM
  •  

    Clause, 

     

    This morning's data contains the following:

     

    Event

    OS

    Hits

    EventType

    FirstHit

    1

    Windows Vista (RTM)

    1

    Hang B1

    6-7-2007

    2

    Windows Vista (RTM)

    1

    Hang XProc B1

    6-10-2007

    3

    Windows Vista (RTM)

    1

    Crash64

    6-11-2007

    4

    Windows Vista (RTM)

    1

    Hang B1

    6-12-2007

     

    It does appear that we are getting some of your events, though perhaps not the ones you are intending. Events may not be immediately sent to our servers for a variety of reasons. One way to verify that the event was correctly reported is to check the computer's Application event log for Event ID 1001 from the "Windows Error Reporting" source. This message should have information about the fault bucket and type of the event. If you don't see this message, it's likely that it was not reported to Microsoft.

     

    If you do see this information, you can enter the fault bucket number in the search dialog on the site to search for the specific event. Also, if you e-mail me this information to <saarp AT microsoft.com> I'll be more than happy to track the event down in our internal systems.

     

    I really want to apologize for the difficulties you're having. It's unfortunate but our telemetry data is really most effective after collecting a higher number of data points. I hope you'll continue working with me to resolve this problem for you.

     

    -Saar Picker

    Developer Portal - http://winqual.microsoft.com/

    Friday, June 15, 2007 7:00 PM
  • Saar,

    thanks a lot again for your help!

    I just glimpsed through the event log on one of our Vista machines, and it does indeed contain quite a number of entries with an event ID of 1001. I'm checking that machine from remote, which for some reason is horribly slow, so I'll look into the details on Monday when I'm in the office again.

    From what I can see here, there should be quite a few crash reports for a test application called "reportfault.exe", which we mapped this week. But again, I'll check the details on Monday.

      Claus

    Friday, June 15, 2007 8:32 PM
  •  

    Claus,

     

    I've located the events you are referring to. In our data they appear to have all been reported on 6/13/07. Our site data has only caught up to 6/12/07 as of this morning, and tomorrow should include this new data. Can you please send me the specific times the events occurred? You mentioned that you have been reporting these events throughout the week. There are some reasons event reporting can be delayed, such as lost network connectivity. I'd like to make sure there are no processing problems on our end.

     

    Thanks for being so patient.

     

    -Saar Picker

    Developer Portal - http://winqual.microsoft.com/

     

    Event data:

     

    Event

    AppName

    AppVer

    Offset

    Hits

    HitDate

    1

    reportfault.exe

    42.42.42.42

    0x000018D5

    1

    2007-06-13

    2

    reportfault.exe

    42.42.42.42

    0x00001625

    2

    2007-06-13

    3

    reportfault.exe

    42.42.42.42

    0x00012928

    2

    2007-06-13

    4

    reportfault.exe

    42.42.42.42

    0x00012928

    4

    2007-06-13

    5

    reportfault.exe

    42.42.42.42

    0x00012928

    2

    2007-06-13

    6

    reportfault.exe

    42.42.42.42

    0x00012928

    1

    2007-06-13

    7

    reportfault.exe

    42.42.42.42

    0x00012928

    1

    2007-06-13

    8

    reportfault.exe

    42.42.42.42

    0x00012928

    4

    2007-06-13

     

    Friday, June 15, 2007 11:40 PM
  • Saar,

    good news: The reports for reportfault.exe (submitted on June 13th) are now becoming visible on the Winqual site for us. The reports come from Vista and XP systems, as expected.
     
    However, I still don't see the expected Vista crash reports for our main application yet. I guess I'll just run some more tests with our latest code tomorrow, and then wait a few more days.

      Claus

    http://www.clausbrod.de/Blog
    Sunday, June 17, 2007 6:52 AM
  • I have following queries regarding appearing of reports in Winqual.

     

    Suppose, a company has a product named abc.exe. and this product is mapped.

    Now, for every crash, I must be able to see the reports in Winqual - ofcourse after the already mentioned delay(1-2 days).

     

    That product has a new release say version x. Is this new version also needs to be mapped so that the report appears in Winqual. Or we don't need to map each version of the same product - mapping of the original version will do the trick ?

     

    Also, this mapping needs to be done only by Company administrator - each developer does not require to map the product individually.

    But, each developer with their Winqual account can see these reports.

    This is my understanding and doubt on the topic. Please, clarify where I am wrong.

     

    Thanks,

    DHON

     

     

    Wednesday, June 20, 2007 5:47 AM
  • About the first part of your question: We were asking this ourselves just yesterday. I think I once read something on the Winqual site which seemed to indicate that once you've signed your application and registered it once, you don't really have to create new product mappings for each and every new version of the application. This would be convenient, but I'm not sure if I'm just hallucinating.

    On the second part of the question: When you apply for access to the Winqual site, you must specify whether you just want access to the crash reports, or if you also want to create product mappings, or do some even more advanced stuff whch I don't remember. So one approach could be to register developers in "view reports only" mode, and assign an admin or a selected engineer who also has "create product mapping" privileges. At least that's what we did.

    Cheers,

      Claus

    http://www.clausbrod.de/Blog

    Wednesday, June 20, 2007 6:11 AM
  • Hi Claus,

    Thanks for the information.

     

    When your Company's name is already listed in the dropdown of account opening form in Winqual, then if you try to create an account by providing userid/password, your account opening request goes to your company's administrator. Once s/he confirms it, then you get a confirmation mail from Winqual saying that your Company's administrator has approved the account. Now, if I login to Winqual, I am directed to Company's page and I can see different reports. Among those available reports I can't see the reportts for crashes that I introduced. Report for earlier version of the s/w is available - but not the one where I am working now. So wanted to know whether I need to map this version also separately to get the work done ! Even if mapping is required it will be done by the Administrator. That is my understanding on the issue.

     

    Thanks,

    DHON

    Wednesday, June 20, 2007 8:45 AM
  • Hi DHON,

     

    Mapping is explicit.  That is to say you are required to map each file you want data on.  If you have a new build you want to track, you need to upload a mapping file for that build.

    Presently, we match events to a company based on the name of the file, its Version, and linkdate (linkdate if possible).  We have processes that watch for cross company file mapping collisions and a team that manages file mapping collisions.  This team will engage all parties involved if we see a mapping collision, and we have a way to automatically decline or authorize a commonly mapped file across companies.

     

    Kind regards,

    -Jason 

     

     

    Wednesday, June 20, 2007 11:23 PM
  • Hi jason,

    Thanks for the reply.

     

    What is your explaination on the following - picked from WER Developer guide ? 

     

    Submitting for a Version Range

     

    If you select ‘This version and all newer versions’ after uploading your product signature, this submission may apply to newer versions as well.  For example, if you submit with version 2.1.1, the submission can also apply to 2.1.2 and 3.0.0.  This will only work if the Product Name and Vendor Name are exactly the same between versions of your application.

     

     

    Suppose, my product version was 5.0 and was mapped. Now, I am working on 5.2. Does it again require to be explicitely mapped ?

     

    Thanks,

    DHON

    Thursday, June 21, 2007 5:18 AM
  • Unfortunately the guide is incorrect if this is in the context of WER Usermode events.  Can you send me the link you are using to get to the guide?  ...I'll work with the content teams to have the guide updated as appropriate ASAP.

     

    Kind regards,

    -Jason

    Thursday, June 21, 2007 5:21 PM
  • Hi Jason,

     

    I was referring to https://winqual.microsoft.com/Help/default.htm#developers_guide_to_wer.htm this link.

    Now click on the Windows Logo Programs -> Software ->New Works With Windows Vista Logo Submission to get the content I was referring.

     

    Here, I need one big big favour from you. I am working with a 20 years old product and I am asked to implement WER. The product was not using ReportFault() also. So whatever I have to implement for Vista certification is using WER - no point of using the old API (ReportFault()).

     

    After going thru several post in this forum I believe that the WER APIs are still not in usable state. Might be Microsoft is still working on these API to give a final touch. I am also not able to post report to the Winqual server by using these APIs. Can you please, confirm whether these APIs can be used successfully in our product or I need to wait for some more time until Microsoft fixes the pending issues. Your comment on these will really help me in saving lots of my valuable time.

     

    Thanks,

    DHON

    Friday, June 22, 2007 6:11 AM
  • Hi DHON,

     

    The APIs are in a usable state.  We use them here at Microsoft .

     

    This is the problem I am seeing for you and Claus is in using WErReportCreate http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms681640.aspx; you are trying to create your own generic crash event, but this is really for creating a non-fatal custom event.  It's probably less than clear in the API documentation but it points to a page at winqual that asks to contact WERBETA@Microsoft.com to register a non-fatal event.  The API to register a generic eventtype does not work without engaging Microsoft to create a registration on the Microsoft reporting servers.  The process is manual today and reviews the signature parameters to ensure that no PII is intended to be collected.  On top of that, the generic eventtype is only for non-fatal events.  I don't think this is the direction you are looking to go.

     

    When you say you are trying to get your 20 year old application to have WER implemented, what does that mean? 

    You will get WER for free without any code simply by not handling the exception yourself.  There are APIs that may be interesting to implement such as Data Collection and Restart/Recovery but I don't see the need to explicitly call WER in your case.  I may be missing some details (perhaps you already handle your crashes in a way that the application requires, and you are simply trying to gain logo status without changing the core behavior).

     

    Kind regards,

    -Jason

     

     

    Friday, June 22, 2007 4:18 PM
  • ...oh, thanks for the link to the outdated information!!  I'll talk to the content owners to have the information updated as soon as possible.

    -Jason

    Friday, June 22, 2007 4:21 PM
  • Jason,

    for an explanation why DHON and I used what looked like purposefully chosen custom event types to you, see the other thread at http://forums.microsoft.com/MSDN/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=1771335&SiteID=1&mode=1

    The "old application" already has its own crash handling code. The idea is to gradually migrate to the WER infrastructure for reporting and handling crashes. The original trigger was Vista, and we were made aware of the WER APIs by documentation which is part of the Microsoft's Vista logo certification package.

      Claus

    http://www.clausbrod.de/Blog

    Friday, June 22, 2007 5:44 PM
  • I see (the light bulb just came on). Thanks Claus.

     

    Let me pull in the Windows Vista Software Logo PM to comment on how to be 'logo compliant' in the cases where applications are handling their own exceptions and not using WER.  It seems that using WER is a Vista Software Logo requirement, so they may have the examples you are looking for.  My team (WER Services on Winqual) and the WER client team do not have the examples you are looking for because it is not recommended to handle your own exception and then call WER.

     

    We could get creative to accomplish this (I have some ideas on how we can accomplish this) but we'll wait and see what the Vista Software Logo PM has to say. 

     

    kind regards,

    -Jason

    Saturday, June 23, 2007 5:45 PM
  • Hi Jason,

     

    First of all, I need to use WER API for Vista logo certification(Test Case 32).

    If we don't assign our own eventtype  while calling WerReportCreate(), then what we need to pass in that parameter ?

    If we assign our own eventtype, in this case if the eventype is not registered with WinQual, our rport will simply be rejected(Bucket Id 8)!  How to overcome this ?

     

    Also without using any WER API, I get a more meaningfull crash report. Does that signify that my application pass the Test Case 32 ?

    If so then I don't need to do anything.   In fact nobody will take the pain of using these APIs to get their product certified.

     

    Thanks,

    DHON

     

    Monday, June 25, 2007 6:28 AM
  • Hi all,

     

    the details of my solution for using WER API functions for crash reports on Vista are now available from http://www.clausbrod.de/Blog/DefinePrivatePublic20070625 - feedback most welcome. Thanks again in particular to Saar and Jason who provided hints on what to look for.

     

    Claus

     

    Monday, June 25, 2007 1:21 PM