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J# is still useful! Don't die, please! RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hi,

     Let's face the fact. I don't think Java will die and C# will also be there for a long time, so J# is still a very useful langue. The GUI between Swing & Windows Form are so different, so when port Java GUI program to .NET, I think re-write in C# should be OK.

     

    However, some libraries are GUI independent. For example, SIP, H.323, ASN.1 and so on . They are pretty expensive library.  It would be nice if they can be recompiled into .NET library by using J# and later they can be invoked by C#, VB.net or C++ CLR. But I saw some news about Microsoft is going to RETIRE the J# around 2015.  Can Microsoft still maintain a stripped version J#? It can only compile and debug non-GUI code. No Windows Form support should be ok. It does not even need to create a console program using this version of J#. Can they just call this tool J# compiler utiltiy? I think people who use J# should agree my point.

     

    Thanks,

    Role777.

     

     

    Monday, August 13, 2007 5:40 AM

Answers

  • Hi –

     

    In terms of retirement, the support for the language would exist till 2015. For more on the support and lifecycle policy read the Product Announcement at the J# Dev Center. That said, the language would still be available post the support period ends and users can use them.

     

    Hope this answers your question.

     

    Thanks

    Gaurav

     

    Friday, August 17, 2007 11:58 AM
  • Hi,

     J# can die now. I found a better solution. IKVM. Try it. use ikvmc with -debug. What you cannot beleive is VC#2008's debugger (or DBGCLR.EXE). It can debug the language it does not know (watch and so on without any problem). Mircosoft really do a good job on the .net debugging.

     

    Roland.

    Monday, August 20, 2007 8:12 AM

All replies

  • absolutely  

     

    i use it at my work and im very happy with it.well i have developed with vb.net,c# and j#...

    J# is the most charismatic language i have ever seen.u can Java applications,%100 OOP,a .net language with one-side compiling what would i want most

     

    well i like developing with it,i hope it doesnt die

    Monday, August 13, 2007 10:12 AM
  • Hmmm..

     I was thinking this could be a good oppertunity for Borland (Code Gear) to create a Borland J#. They can just say Microsoft will not support Visual J# in 2008. The product Visual J# is retired, so come to use Borland J#. Also, I heard Borland themself are using J# in their together suite, so it make sense for them just create a Borland J#. They could make more money then their exsiting product.

     

     

    Thanks,

    Roland.

     

     

    Monday, August 13, 2007 4:31 PM
  • hi Roland,

    are u working in Borland?

     

    well i liked visual j# ide and i may not like other j# IDEs as Visual j#,so lets see Borlands J# IDE first than i can think twice

     

     

    Monday, August 13, 2007 6:05 PM
  • Hi Ibrahim,

     I don't work for Borland. I am just an innocent programmer. 10 years ago, everything is C++, we just use the only one language. Then there was Java and then C#. Suddenly, we need to maitain 3 copies of library. If we can some how reuse J#/Java code, the life will become easier.

     

    Why not C++/CLR .net? C++ CLR acutally has more problems. For VC C++ native code, if there is a memory leak issue, I have very good tools can find the leak (Like GFlag, LeakBroswer, HeapAgent and so on). If I use C++ CLR and still using pointer, it still cause memory leak and memory corruption. The worse part is there is no good tool to fight C++ CLR memory leaking when using pointer, so C# and J# are still the best for new code.

     

    Thanks,

    Roland.

     

     

    Monday, August 13, 2007 11:02 PM
  • well i can join you then

    Wednesday, August 15, 2007 7:43 AM
  • Hi –

     

    In terms of retirement, the support for the language would exist till 2015. For more on the support and lifecycle policy read the Product Announcement at the J# Dev Center. That said, the language would still be available post the support period ends and users can use them.

     

    Hope this answers your question.

     

    Thanks

    Gaurav

     

    Friday, August 17, 2007 11:58 AM
  • Hi,

     J# can die now. I found a better solution. IKVM. Try it. use ikvmc with -debug. What you cannot beleive is VC#2008's debugger (or DBGCLR.EXE). It can debug the language it does not know (watch and so on without any problem). Mircosoft really do a good job on the .net debugging.

     

    Roland.

    Monday, August 20, 2007 8:12 AM
  • Not only do I think that J# should not die but I think it should add new features added in Java5 like generics and annotations. It would be just fun to see if MS could do a better Java than Sun, just the thought of it makes the whole thing very exciting. As I use Java5 extensively I do miss those features very much. Just think, Java generics, done right, Java with LINQ, Expressions, even Closures before they get their stuff together.
    Of course, it is questionable as a business investment. What I wouldn't mind though would be a community spinoff on codeplex. As a side note, there's a bunch of Java source code availible now as well, albeit GPL (but dual licenced).
    Would the MS/Sun agreement about Java prohibit this kind of development?

    Srgjan
    Saturday, August 25, 2007 1:30 AM
  • I consider that there is serious difference between Java's generics and CLI's one. Java's generics is recognized only by compiler. 

    For example the following Java program works fine.



    import java.util.*;

    public class Program
    {
     public static void main(String[] args) throws Exception
     {
      ArrayList<Integer> intList = new ArrayList<Integer>();
      Object o = intList;
      ArrayList<Object> objList = (ArrayList<Object>)o;
     }
    }

     

    But, the following C# program doesn't work.



    using System;
    using System.Collections.Generic;

    class Program
    {
        static void Main(string[] args)
        {
            List<Int32> intList = new List<Int32>();
            Object o = intList;
            List<Object> objList = (List<Object>)o;
        }
    }


     

    Some people say CLI should allow to cast from Foo<T> to Foo<object>. I agree with them, but it is not an essential solution.

    I believe that IKVM http://www.ikvm.net/ has most of features to migrate existing Java code or to share Java code and CLI code. So IKVM is provided under zlib license, you can contribute it ans use freely.

     

     

     

    Saturday, August 25, 2007 1:32 PM
  • In fact, that why I said real generics. I would like J# to have the CLI concept of generics not the one with type erasure. My point is this, I do not want a 100% compatible Java with it's flaws and lackings, I'd like a better, faster, cleaner Java, with real generics, properties, closures, events, delegates, LINQ, expressions ecc.
    Saturday, August 25, 2007 2:50 PM
  • riddiculous. java programmers are growing more even now compared to C#, all the colleges are teaching it.

    instead of claiming customers are complaining J# is deisgning start supporting it and build more features to enhance it. too many products out there supporting java's syntax that have migrated to J# - and stop making false claims - I doubt if  customers would complain of an EXTRA language in a studio - so develop it further, support J# or I am sure an alternative company will support it.

     

    support J# because too many of us won't support C# - every year a new language will come out that will have something special and you won't be able to keep up. so make it .NET and not VB and C# Studio - otherwise there is no meaning to it.

    Monday, March 31, 2008 3:43 PM
  • Here's what I wish they would do with J#:

    1. Incorporate Ujihara-san's JSharpLib as part of the J# runtime.
    2. Add in the language changes up to Java 1.6 - at least some like enums.
    3. Support every 1.6 method in the wrapper classes - String, Character, Integer, Long, Real, Float, & Boolean.

    For us we must use J# indefinitely going forward. The above changes would help us quite a bit.

     

    Or in the alternative, open source it like Microsoft did with WIX.

     

    thanks - dave

    http://www.gotjsharp.com/

    Thursday, May 22, 2008 3:35 PM
  • Java will not die.More people are using it than any other language and its worldwide use will simply prevent that from happening. Microsoft does not control wether java should stay or not because the people and most importantly the companies use it around the globe for simply everything from cell phone applets to gaming and web serfing. Therfore, if Microsoft attempts to get rid of javascript,Microsoft will lose money, and will lose popularity. The later will occur because other companies will suppoert java, and will have the chance to shine in field that Microsoft is no longer popular in, which as a consequence result in the earlier: lose of money. 

    Wednesday, May 28, 2008 10:35 PM
  • Hi –

     

    In terms of retirement, the support for the language would exist till 2015. For more on the support and lifecycle policy read the Product Announcement at the J# Dev Center. That said, the language would still be available post the support period ends and users can use them.

     

    Hope this answers your question.

     

    Thanks

    Gaurav

     


    Thanks for your analysis! Now I got it, It's helpful to me.
    Tuesday, February 15, 2011 4:05 AM
  • Q. Given VJ# support will be dropped,  should effort be expended to rework VJ#
        to support current .Net4 framework and run within VS2010 ?
    A. No - since source code does not seem to be currently available.

    Q. So, should a VisualJava Compiler project, including OpenJDK as a base,
        be considered?  
        The project would develop a product that would plug into VS2010
        and support .Net4 via IKVM.

    A. Your thoughts ?


    Bob
    Sunday, February 20, 2011 7:04 PM
  • If VJ# is of value to current and future developers, why shouldn't a variant of it be developed?
    Bob
    Friday, March 18, 2011 11:40 AM
  • Q. Given VJ# support will be dropped, should effort be expended now to replace VJ#?
         The community effort would develop an opensource product that would plug into VS20XX, be based on OpenJDK, and support .Net4 via IKVM.

    A. Any interest?


    Bob

    Bob
    Wednesday, April 13, 2011 1:47 PM