random crashing

Question

EW4 SP2 still crashes randomly, seems to be an ongoing problem.

Using it on windows 7 but it exhibits this on 8 too

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Windows MVP, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. More people have climbed Everest than having 3 MVP's on the wall.

Hardcore Games, Legendary is the only Way to Play

Developer | Windows IT | Chess | Economics | Vegan Advocate | PC Reviews

Answer 1

Unbelievable. You've been around enough to know how to use the search function, and you must have seen posts about this and the certain fixes: the dotNET Framework and WPF. You've also been around long enough to know that this isn't MS tech support.

The problem is external to EW and it's one of the subsystems that EW relies on. That's what it always is.

And Windows 8 is experimental at this point. All bets are off in a prerelease version; you're on your own.

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It's not the heat, it's the stupidity.

Answer 2

actually I have the RTM version of 8

which version of EW is actually the most stable?

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Windows MVP, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. More people have climbed Everest than having 3 MVP's on the wall.

Hardcore Games, Legendary is the only Way to Play

Developer | Windows IT | Chess | Economics | Vegan Advocate | PC Reviews

Answer 3

Are you serious..."which version of EW is actually the most stable?"???

It's NOT EW! How many times do you have to hear that? It's a problem on your computer.

Think logically...cough...If there were a stability problem with EW, everyone would experience it. Got it?

99.99999% of people have no problem with any version of EW crashing. That means that the problem is not within EW, but outside. And time and again, the cause is isolated to a corrupted installation of the dotNET Framework or WPF that brings down EW.

And it makes no difference what prerelease version of Windows 8 you have. Windows 8 is not yet listed as a supported OS for EW. You are on your own, as is everyone, when you experiment with a prerelease product.

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It's not the heat, it's the stupidity.

Answer 4

You have to smile :)

I mostly use XP and forum regulars *beat me up* as it's a "10 year old OS" - BUT XP is listed as a supported OS for EW4.

Then someone else uses W8 and also gets cut down... :(

Answer 5

You have to smile :)

I mostly use XP and forum regulars *beat me up* as it's a "10 year old OS" - BUT XP is listed as a supported OS for EW4.

Then someone else uses W8 and also gets cut down... :(

You're not fully aware of Vegan Fanatic's history.

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Expression Web MVP

Answer 6

Maybe not. But his post seems fair enough.

For a newbie like me they are valid questions.
I would like to know if EW4 will run on W8 - that doesn't seem too much to ask in an official Microsoft hosted product forum :)

Answer 7

Vegan should already know the answer to his own question. From the other day:

i tried fp03, ew1, ew2, ew3 and ew4 in a vm and all worked fine together with no clashing at all

Often it seems Vegan's random or semi-random, often non-sensible, questions seem only to promote his web site.

Badgerer, once you have a computer running the release of Win8, just install the EW4 trial on it. Then you will know how it works for certain on your Win8 installation with or without hiccups. I haven't had issues on XP Pro (a failry clean installation used for maintaining legacy applications I need once in a blue moon) nor on Win7. I'll probably await a new laptop running Win8 before I find out if there are issues on my own computer.

Take care, Mike

Answer 8

I have tried looking at the problem with my development tools but its useless without more resources I do not have at my disposal.

It annoys me to no end when EW crashes costing me a bit of work.

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Windows MVP, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. More people have climbed Everest than having 3 MVP's on the wall.

Hardcore Games, Legendary is the only Way to Play

Developer | Windows IT | Chess | Economics | Vegan Advocate | PC Reviews

Answer 9

Then don't use it, Vegan! Or, since you seem to know that it's going to crash on you, and you clearly don't intend to take the time to rebuild your dotNET stack, save your work early and often.

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Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

Answer 10

I was creating some code in PHP when it crashed, had to waste 5 minutes redoing the work.

Usually I am pretty good at saving but other tools feature autosave, why not EW?

Excel can save automatically, never had problems with that product

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Windows MVP, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. More people have climbed Everest than having 3 MVP's on the wall.

Hardcore Games, Legendary is the only Way to Play

Developer | Windows IT | Chess | Economics | Vegan Advocate | PC Reviews

Answer 11

Why are you asking us that?  Good grief.

Answer 12

EW runs fine on Windows 8 at least the 3 versions I've installed in on - developer preview, Consumer Preview and RC. I have installed RTM but haven't tried to run EW on it due to driver issues.

Vegan stated he has the same issue with Win 7. I on the other hand have run EW 4 on 8 different machines of different configurations from Win 7 32 to Win 7 Ultimate 64 to Win 8. Some are running Windows natively others under Parallels (convergence mode). None of which have had any stability issues whatsoever.

The Win 8 question will be more pertinent when Win 8 is released to other than MSDN subscribers and MS Partners on Oct 26th. Heck, I can't even get Intel graphics to run at native screen resolution (resulting in distorted text) on my Win 8 machine running RTM because those drivers are not yet available and Win 8 won't let me install anything other than the out of the box Microsoft "basic default" driver. There aren't chipset drivers available yet either. Sort of hard to evaluate the performance of a program that is heavily dependent on graphcis resources when you can't even run your system at its default display settings.

I've been told that the Win 8 drivers for my system will be available on October 26th - the official release date.

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Free Expression Web Tutorials
For an Expression Web forum with without the posting issues try expressionwebforum.com

Answer 13

well perhaps a new version will surface that fixes the stability problem

nothing on the radar I could see

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Windows MVP, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. More people have climbed Everest than having 3 MVP's on the wall.

Hardcore Games, Legendary is the only Way to Play

Developer | Windows IT | Chess | Economics | Vegan Advocate | PC Reviews

Answer 14

A new version of what?!

Windows 8?

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Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

Answer 15

Vegan's problem might also stem from the old, cobbled together, home-built computers that he constantly bemoans the state of on his site.

But I'd still bet dollars to donuts that it's a dotNet Framework or WPF problem (but he refuses to do anything about that, so who knows?).

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It's not the heat, it's the stupidity.

Answer 16

When I developed my password generator, I used C++, same for my appwiz tool

I use PHP for web site server side, JavaScript on the client

now because of that I do not encounter .NET at all outside of my awareness that Office etc are all done with it

curios as EW4 is the only program that is unstable outside of games

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Windows MVP, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. More people have climbed Everest than having 3 MVP's on the wall.

Hardcore Games, Legendary is the only Way to Play

Developer | Windows IT | Chess | Economics | Vegan Advocate | PC Reviews

Answer 17

EW 4 is very likely the only program on your computer that relies on dotNET Framework 4.5 and WPF. How many times do we have to tell you that??!!??

This is a very, very simple matter of deduction. It is basic troubleshooting. The steps...

EW4 is stable for almost everyone (so it, in itself, is not flawed in a way that makes it crash by itself).
EW4 relies on dotNET Framework 4.5 and WPF.
EW4 is the only program on your computer that relies on both dotNET Framework 4.5 and WPF.
When EW4 crashes for other people, the fix is virtually always found by fixing dotNET Framework 4.5 and WPF.
Ergo--The first place to look is the dotNET Framework 4.5 and WPF.

Stop asking questions if you don't intend to listen to the answers!

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It's not the heat, it's the stupidity.

Answer 18

according to my machine WPF is Feb 2010

my windows setups are always fully updated

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Windows MVP, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. More people have climbed Everest than having 3 MVP's on the wall.

Hardcore Games, Legendary is the only Way to Play

Developer | Windows IT | Chess | Economics | Vegan Advocate | PC Reviews

Answer 19

Unbelievable.

It doesn't make a bit of difference what the dates are. You most likely have a corrupted installation or file in the dotNet Framework or WPF.

Search the forum and you'll see that that has been the problem time and again.

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It's not the heat, it's the stupidity.

Answer 20

A new version of what?!

Windows 8?

God, what a bloody maroon...!

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Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

Maroon?.................... he's a deep red color?

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Expression Web MVP

Answer 21

If your problem is due to a .NET corruption problem you might be able to tell which .NET call has caused the problem by using Process Monitor.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb896645.aspx

.NET corruption appears not to be an uncommon occurrence and it is not very easy to reinstall it.  http://kb.gfi.com/articles/Skynet_Article/6032

If a program has a high failure rate due to a dependence on another program, it doesn't buy much sympathy from the users to simple seek absolution by claiming "it's not our fault". 

Answer 22

"If a program has a high failure rate due to a dependence on another program, it doesn't buy much sympathy from the users to simple seek absolution by claiming "it's not our fault". "

Not very logical TB.  We say "it's not EW's fault", not "it's not our fault".  We are not EW. And we point people to the net framework.  Just what lack of sympathy can a pointer to the problem cause?  Should we let them waste time reinstalling EW over and over, for example, in the mistaken belief that it is EW's fault?

Answer 23

Seriously, TB? Have you not understood what we have been saying?

Over and over and over and over again, we have said that it's not EW's fault, not that it's not our fault. And it's true.

Time and time and time and time again, we have explained the dependencies on the dotNET Framework and WPF. And we have explained about uninstalling the Framework properly and the importance of running the dotNET Clean Up Utility (a thread is linked to in the Forum FAQ, and the newest info from Aaron Stebner is here: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/astebner/archive/2012/08/04/10336934.aspx). Your link made no mention of the Clean Up Utility, which is vital in order to avoid wasting time propagating the old errors in the new installation.

What we have said, and what is entirely true, is that we are not MS Tech Support. How have you missed that?

Speaking of which, I have found yet another MS post pointing people to this forum for tech support...

Q: Is customer support offered with Expression Trial versions?

A: Formal support is not offered for this Expression Trials. Instead, we have a community Web site and forums for all the Expression products where you can solicit feedback and help get your questions answered by the both the Expression community and the moderators from the different Expression teams.

It's in the Expression Web 4 FAQ, at http://www.microsoft.com/expression/products/Web_FAQ.aspx

Jim Cheshire: Can you get someone to change that post, please?

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It's not the heat, it's the stupidity.

Answer 24

Jim Cheshire: Can you get someone to change that post, please?

Unless, of course, you plan to actually have active moderators here, who actually do take part in the forum, and provide "feedback and help" to clueless users, and maybe mark correct answers when questioners don't bother. You know, the stuff that actual moderators usually do, and that that post indicated that they would do.

Right. I didn't think so. Might want to go ahead and get that post at http://www.microsoft.com/expression/products/Web_FAQ.aspx changed...

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Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

Answer 25

I want it to be clear that I did not report anyone's posts here to be abusive. It is clear that I have a different opinion about who's fault it is when a program crashes and I do get the idea that some folks don't think I'm entitled to have that opinion but I don't think that it's abusive. The fact that "we are not Microsoft" does not mean that others can't express an opinion. You don't own the board.

Answer 26

I don't think anyone thought you marked the posts. You're not childish like that. ;-)

Nobody said you can't have a different opinion, either. What you can't do is accuse people of saying "it's not our fault" when they aren't saying that.

And when people say "we are not tech support" or "we are not Microsoft", that's the truth. There's no reason not to state it. And in general it's said to people who are brand new to the forum, didn't read the Forum FAQ (as everyone should know to do in any forum by now), and who are operating under the mistaken impression (sometimes fostered by MS itself) that we are tech support. And just because some people have the opinion that we are tech support doesn't mean that anyone here shouldn't disabuse them of that notion.

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It's not the heat, it's the stupidity.

Answer 27

I want it to be clear that I did not report anyone's posts here to be abusive.

No, I personally think that it was Vegan. He's done it before recently, and although it is new behavior for him, I have ceased putting anything past that sadly disturbed collection of apparently chemically imbalanced brain cells. Also, one of the posts marked abusive was Kathy's response to Vegan, which didn't even mention your name. So, while it is disturbing to see that he has begun of late to mark posts critical of him as abusive, a sad regression even further into the infantile personality shell he appears to find most comfortable, it does appear to mark a regrettable new stage in his participation in this forum.

It is clear that I have a different opinion about who's fault it is when a program crashes and I do get the idea that some folks don't think I'm entitled to have that opinion but I don't think that it's abusive.

You can have any opinion you wish. That was not what we (well... I) objected to. What I objected to, and rightly, I believe, was your proposition that we need to "buy sympathy" from affected users, or to seek "absolution" for some sin (mortal? venial? what?), when we have nothing whatsoever to do with the creation of the program, and are provided nothing in the way of technical or engineering documentation with which to aid in troubleshooting.

The fact that "we are not Microsoft" does not mean that others can't express an opinion.

No one said that you couldn't, if all you did was express an opinion. But the statement in question basically made it seem that we were somehow at fault for something over which we have no control, and about which we can do nothing. That's an "opinion" which unfairly, and inaccurately, paints us as villains, and we have every right in that circumstance to speak in our own defense.

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Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

Answer 28

Well, this train wreck of a thread has followed the typical arc of one started by Vegan; it started out dumb and rapidly went south from there, ending up with a trail of "abusive" posts and off-topic chatter. Personally, I think the best strategy is simply to not respond to any further inane posts. I will henceforth do just that. He has demonstrated in the past that he is perfectly willing to carry the "conversation" all by himself, and there seems to be no lack of newbies who are willing to feed the troll. Perhaps if all the regulars refrain from responding, some of the newbies will try to respond until they realize that you guys are right about Vegan and quit complaining about your replies. Remember, if a Vegan posts in the forum and nobody cares, he'll still make noise, but it doesn't matter. I for one intend to direct my energies in replying towards those capable of actually listening to an answer. Oh, and if any newbs want to take offense at this post and chastise me, I'll gladly add them to my growing "naughty" list.

Jim

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'Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death. Thomas Paine

Answer 29

Will, I hope that everyone notices that I never responded to this thread.

Oops.

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ClarkNK, A.K.A. HomePage Doctor
HomePageDoctor.com -- Expression Web database tutorials
Ownertrades.com -- Created with Expression, VWDExress, SQL Express, and ASP.NET
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Answer 30

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

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Windows MVP, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. More people have climbed Everest than having 3 MVP's on the wall.

Hardcore Games, Legendary is the only Way to Play

Developer | Windows IT | Chess | Economics | Vegan Advocate | PC Reviews

Answer 31

Fingers firmly in ears.

Answer 32

Please remember to mark this answer as helpful.

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ClarkNK, A.K.A. HomePage Doctor
HomePageDoctor.com -- Expression Web database tutorials
Ownertrades.com -- Created with Expression, VWDExress, SQL Express, and ASP.NET
Arvixe -- My favored web host

Answer 33

Please remember to mark this answer as helpful.

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ClarkNK, A.K.A. HomePage Doctor
HomePageDoctor.com -- Expression Web database tutorials
Ownertrades.com -- Created with Expression, VWDExress, SQL Express, and ASP.NET
Arvixe -- My favored web host

OMG you certainly pissed away a lot of time on that flame. LOL

Answer 34

OMG you certainly pissed away a lot of time on that flame. LOL

Heh heh, for 15 minutes I just lost all control, couldn't stop myself.

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ClarkNK, A.K.A. HomePage Doctor
HomePageDoctor.com -- Expression Web database tutorials
Ownertrades.com -- Created with Expression, VWDExress, SQL Express, and ASP.NET
Arvixe -- My favored web host

Answer 35

Further on the definition of "maroon":

maroon, n. – genius who scheduled the third and final 2012 Presidential Debate opposite both Monday Night Football and the seventh game of the National League Championship Series.

heh, heh... ;-)

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Please remember to "Mark as Answer" the responses that resolved your issue. It is common courtesy to recognize those who have helped you, and it also makes it easier for visitors to find the resolution later.

Answer 36

Oh, was there a debate last night? Another of the Red Puppet vs the Blue Puppet series?

Answer 37

Yes, there was. And one of those "puppets" will have a big effect on our lives for the next 4 years and on the Supreme Court for the next 3 decades.

Ninny.

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Answer 38

Yes, there was. And one of those "puppets" will have a big effect on our lives for the next 4 years and on the Supreme Court for the next 3 decades.

Ninny.

We really should be selecting the puppet master.